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Hall of Famer [21618]
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It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 11:20 AM
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bad at processing information and so bad at making good decisions that they are currently calling for the firing of Jack Leggett.
I can understand the Dabo doubters. It is at least a justifiable position to not want Dabo as our head coach, especially right when he was hired. I don't agree with it at this point, but I won't argue it is stupid.
I could not even argue with the complaining about OP before he left. It seemed a legitimate argument to me that OP may be a program re-builder and incapable of ever taking Clemson deep into the tourney. I didn't necessarily agree with all of it, but it made sense at least.
But these people who are calling for Jack to be fired absolutely HAVE to be firmly below average intelligence. There is no justification at all, on any level, for this "debate" on whether or not Jack Leggett should be fired. The points on their side are simple. Lately, the team hasn't been doing well and Jack has no national championships ever and lately SCAR has had a better team than us. Never mind that (when limiting yourself to reality) that JL has more success in the last 10 years than like ~98% of coaches around the country. There are 100 reasons why Jack is an elite coach and we know that nearly every school would jump to get him... but some idiots on here simply don't realize they are idiots and they embarrass themselves by calling for his job.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 11:40 AM
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FSU fans said the same thing about Bobby Bowden until he ran their program into the ground.
All I know is that
1. Recruiting has fallen off the map
2. We are losing.....a lot
3. We are on our way to being out of the NCAA tourney for the 2nd time in four years
4. Slap bunting
5. Errors, errors, and more errors
He won......Bill Won......I am pretty sure the next guy we put in Jack's position WILL WIN.
The guy is getting old. At some point it will end. It ends for all of us no matter the profession. Just sayin
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Rooter [203]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 11:52 AM
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> FSU fans said the same thing about Bobby Bowden until
> he ran their program into the ground.
>
> All I know is that
>
> 1. Recruiting has fallen off the map
> 2. We are losing.....a lot
> 3. We are on our way to being out of the NCAA
> tourney for the 2nd time in four years
> 4. Slap bunting
> 5. Errors, errors, and more errors
>
> He won......Bill Won......I am pretty sure the next
> guy we put in Jack's position WILL WIN.
>
> The guy is getting old. At some point it will end.
> It ends for all of us no matter the profession.
> . Just sayin
You simply DO NOT have a clue and one who appears to lack the experience to objectively process information, period.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 11:55 AM
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Lame response. If you think i am wrong tell me where i am wrong. Don't be a typical dbag poster
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Scout Team [185]
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We were in the final four last season
Apr 3, 2011, 11:58 AM
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Not years ago, like Bowden at FSU. A rough stretch of games does not equal running the program into the ground.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 12:04 PM
[ in reply to Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so ] |
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The guy is getting old. At some point it will end. It ends for all of us no matter the profession. Just sayin
Define "OLD". I think Jack is younger than I am. You calling me old too?
JK - B Bowden and Joe Pa are "OLD" IMO, but Jack is YOUNG. Very weak to think he should be canned due to being OLD. Nah - Jack is losing this year - but dang - he deserves a few YEARS of bad results before this "firing" crap comes up IMO. Jack is fine. Yes - we might not win it all this year. BFD. We've been there enough that he gets a pass every once in awhile. Tough crowd. I guess I'm in the camp as the OP.
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Scout Team [170]
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: 57 is old? Seriously?
Apr 3, 2011, 5:30 PM
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That makes Augie a freaking science experiment. Bob Barkeresque
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Rooter [200]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 11:56 AM
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He took clemson to the BCS of baseball last year. Yet they want him gone? AMAZING!
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All-In [27375]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 12:09 PM
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The problems is ... there are a lot of brilliant people on tigernet with an abundance of coaching knowledge who in reality have seldom played and probably never coached a game of anything. "If ignorance was a bliss we would all blisters." A saying of my high school coach that it very true. Jack isn't going anywhere so you experts need to find another outlet!
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Rock Defender [54]
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2 ACC titles in 17 yrs... not that great...
Apr 3, 2011, 12:06 PM
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face it, he inhereted a top notch program that was winning ACC titles on avg of every 3 or 4 yrs. Our recruiting has fallen off of late. Last yr, we got hot at just the right time. The addage is that 1 run games are decided by coaching, and we always lose more 1 run games than we win bc Jack gets outcoached. This yr we're 0-5 in 1 run games. If you knew a lot of baseball you would see that Jack makes a lot of bad decisions that our talent overcomes. With our recruiting falling off now, we'll start getting worse and worse bc we wont be able to overcome his bad coaching. He's a great practice coach, fundamentals, etc. But he falls short with in-game strategy.
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CU Guru [1446]
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In game stategy...it's baseball,you hit and field better
Apr 3, 2011, 2:38 PM
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than the other team.Last time I checked,#7 was at 3rd base coaching,not hitting and fielding.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: In game stategy...it's baseball,you hit and field better
Apr 3, 2011, 5:32 PM
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Last time I checked he was the same guy that was recruiting Maine, Vermont, and New York heavily and watching top prospects from our own state who CAN HIT and FIELD go elsewhere.
Lame excuse
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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Keep in mind back then a lot of the ACC wasn't very good and
Apr 3, 2011, 3:51 PM
[ in reply to 2 ACC titles in 17 yrs... not that great... ] |
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we were only playing a 1/3 of the conference games that we play now. In fact, in many years that we won the ACC regular season titles we didn't even make the NCAA tournament.
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Zealot [721]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 12:30 PM
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Any post on TigerNet should never surpriae you. Anonymous posts creates the perfect environment for "surprising" posts.
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CU Guru [1427]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 12:39 PM
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You must be really smart because I feel exactly as you do! There are reasons legitimate reasons to doubt Dabo or to have doubted OP but Jack's record speaks for itself. We were in the CWS last year, not years and years ago. We will probably turn it around this season but if not, it will just be a blip on the radar.
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110%er [6768]
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FIRE HIM!***
Apr 3, 2011, 12:58 PM
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Asst Coach [748]
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4-3 ncarolina top 6***
Apr 3, 2011, 3:01 PM
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110%er [6106]
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So it is ok to criticize OP for not winning a tourney game
Apr 3, 2011, 3:32 PM
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despite Clemson's lack of any tradition in basketball plus the terrible mess Shyatt left.
Dabo hasn't been around long enough to judge. He has pulled off one of the best recruiting classes in Clemson history and won a division ( something Tommy never did). Granted the jury is still out on Dabo however.
Jack inherited Bill Wilhelm's team, not exactly chopped liver. We have better facilities and fan support than most of the ACC, yet we can't seem to win the regular season or tournament championship in the ACC more than once in 10 years. We choke twice to the coots in Omaha -0-4 and nobody is supposed to complain? We were preseason top 10 year and we are playing horrible.
Everybody has a bad year. So ok, this might be his bad year. I don't fault anyone with questioning Jack or the direction we are headed.
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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Leggett has been here 17 years, his success has nothing to
Apr 3, 2011, 3:45 PM
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do with Coach Wilhelm. Every single player to play for Leggett has played in a College World Series. He's one of the winningest coaches in college baseball. We were one of the final 4 teams in the country just last year. To act like his job should be in jeopardy is asinine! Not winning it all does not make him a bad coach. It took Roy Williams 17 years to win a title. Was he a bad coach before? Complaining about Coach Leggett is just dumb imo.
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110%er [6106]
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I don't think anyone would call him a "bad coach"
Apr 3, 2011, 3:51 PM
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That is not the question. The question is he the BEST coach that we can get? Maybe, but people have the right to question it.
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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And who is better? Someone who was mentored by Leggett?
Apr 3, 2011, 3:56 PM
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Yeah, that's great idea!
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110%er [6106]
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Bobby Knight mentored Mike Krzyzewski
Apr 3, 2011, 3:59 PM
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so what?
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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Doesn't make them bad coaches but when Bobby Knight was
Apr 3, 2011, 4:02 PM
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coaching at Indiana (outside of his non basketball issues) they would've never replaced him with Coach K.
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110%er [6106]
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Bobby Knight won National Championships.***
Apr 3, 2011, 4:04 PM
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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You brought up that comparison not me***
Apr 3, 2011, 4:06 PM
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110%er [6106]
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Bob Devaney and Tom Osbourn***
Apr 3, 2011, 4:14 PM
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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I don't get that? Tom Osborne wasn't coaching at another
Apr 3, 2011, 4:25 PM
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school and Devaney retired and hired Osborne himself. Plus Devaney won a national title which is against what you said. Needless to say there weren't any Nebraska fans calling to hire Osborne while Devaney was their coach.
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110%er [6106]
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how do you know there weren't any Nebraska fans
Apr 3, 2011, 4:41 PM
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calling for Devaney to step down? He was only 57 (sound familiar?). There was certainly some grumbling before he promoted Osbourne to OC.
The point is, you act like it would be stupid to replace Leggett with someone that he mentored. I'm not so sure it would be a bad idea.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: how do you know there weren't any Nebraska fans
Apr 3, 2011, 5:36 PM
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At some point the odds of that happening are good just due to the aging out of coaches. Whose to say Pawlowski and Sully weren't the key to Leggett's early success? Look at what Kevin O Sullivan has turned UF into....before he went there they were a struggling program
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Orange Blooded [4988]
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You could say that if Leggett hasn't had success, but he's
Apr 3, 2011, 6:00 PM
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one of the most successful coaches in college baseball. He was in the CWS final 4 last year. This season isn't over yet. Every player he has had in 17 years has been to Omaha. Where has he faltered? Yeah, this season is not going as planned, but it isn't over yet. Even if we didn't make the tourney this year he's earned the right to have a bad season. It's stupid logic by some of you!
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Addict [438]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 7:43 PM
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You know, I think it is easy to sit behind a computer and insult someone else's intelligence, but whatever makes you feel better. But since you think I don't have a reason for being fed up with Jack Leggett, let me explain it for you. It has something to do with his lack of success in big games. His teams play tight in those situations almost all the time. Probably part of the reason his teams have only won two ACC titles in 17 years and why they get embarrassed by the chickens in Omaha every time. That is a direct reflection on the coach. All baseball teams go through slumps but for several years in a row now I have watched our baseball team have very poor fundamentals. I didn't get to listen to the game friday but I did listen to the one saturday and Dan Scott was saying that the team gave up 7 unearned runs on friday and had given up 3 more through like 5 innings on saturday. That is 10 unearned runs through a game and a half. I think they gave up a few more today. And it is not just a bad stretch it is a trend. Fielding has been a problem for years. Taking called third strikes has been a problem for several years. Our base running fundamentals are bad too. It seems we get picked off once a game. We got thrown out in some kind of delayed steal the other night late in the game when we were down by 2 or 3 runs. That is inexcusable. All of these things are a reflection on coaching. The players play tight and make mistake after mistake because I believe Leggett makes them that way. Right now we are an average hitting team, an average pitching team, an awful fielding team, and a below average base running team. That is a recipe for a bad team. And next year will be worse. I just don't see it turning around. I hope I am wrong. I really do. I just don't see it though. Bottom line is that it is Jack's program and he is ultimately responsible for the results. And we are on our way to missing a regional for the second time in four years. That is unacceptable in my mind for this program; I don't care what you have done in the past.
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CU Guru [1073]
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Re: It still surprises me that there are adults who are so
Apr 3, 2011, 10:19 PM
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I agree with your comments 100%; this is NOT a well coached team.
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Replies: 33
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