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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Someone please explain something to me
Oct 6, 2010, 12:12 PM
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Since the horror of the 90s, Clemson football is in better shape than it's been since the Danny Ford era. Most of us are happy with Dabo as our coach and look for great things in the near future
Clemson basketball is now a force to contend with in the ACC each season. This year's recruits show signs of an even better future.
Baseball under Jack Leggett had an awesome year including a trip to Omaha
Our athletic facilities are among the best in the country and steadily improving. The West Zone project is envied by schools across the country and recruits are extremely impressed when touring our campus.
The gameday atmosphere at Death Valley is as great as it's ever been. Regularly ranked in the top 5 nationally by various publications.
We continually get top recruits to visit Clemson and looking to recover quickly from the 2008-09 recruiting letdown with the coaching change
Regardless of all the claims of how we achieved the status, Clemson is recognized as one of the top universities in America overall.
Why then, do some of you b1tchers, p1ssers and moaners continuously berate our administration (school and athletic dept) for what you perceive as ineptness and incompetence?
What qualifications do you b1tchers, p1ssers and moaners have to determine how good of a job our administration is doing?
What specific solutions do you b1tchers, p1ssers and moaners have for those perceived problems?
How many of you b1tchers, p1ssers and moaners are privy to the limitations faced by our administration?
How many of you b1tchers, p1ssers and moaners do it just to have something to b1tch, p1ss and moan about?
Seriously, is it because you once got a parking ticket on campus? TDP didn't hire who you wanted him to?
Or is it simply because you're a negative nancy with nothing outside of a message board that you can voice your negativity?
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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Why?..
Oct 6, 2010, 12:18 PM
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what qualifications to you have to deserve my opinon???
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Hall of Famer [24238]
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None of us have the qualifications, so quit posting.
Oct 6, 2010, 12:21 PM
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period. Thank you in advance.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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that's the point thanks for proving it.***
Oct 6, 2010, 12:22 PM
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CU Medallion [73569]
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quit posting already!!!!!!!!***
Oct 6, 2010, 12:22 PM
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Hall of Famer [24238]
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Then, quit posting any of your opinions here
Oct 6, 2010, 12:25 PM
[ in reply to that's the point thanks for proving it.*** ] |
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You will not, I repeat not, be missed for any of your sad sour observations of life you express here. I can only imagine the burden you put on those that have to live with and around you. They have my prayers for putting up with a bitter soul like you that only lives to make others as bitter as you are.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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then stop reading my posts......lol.....it's simple
Oct 6, 2010, 12:30 PM
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and i see you didn't get the point that YOU proved
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Zealot [840]
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CU Medallion [73569]
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what qualifications do you have to
Oct 6, 2010, 12:22 PM
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complain about bitchers and moaners? If you want to come on a board where people only shine sun up your ####, maybe you should start your own and have that as a rule.
I'd rather have real opinions and real talk than sunshine pumpers. Does complaining get out of hand sometimes? maybe, but don't read it if you don't want to. pretty simple if you ask me.
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Aficionado [198]
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^^^^^^ Has an awesome signature picture. That is all.***
Oct 6, 2010, 2:13 PM
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110%er [6219]
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Post of the day***
Oct 6, 2010, 12:22 PM
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Someone please explain something to me
Oct 6, 2010, 12:32 PM
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What I think it boils down to is the fact that we continually underachieve/crap the bed in big situations.
Like last year we finally got over the hump to get to the ACCCG and our defense crapped the bed. Lost to Maryland who went 2-10, you know the story...
Basketball finally got over the hump to get in the big dance in consecutive years. Had a big lead over Villanova and gave the game away. Fought back against Michigan but couldn't pull it out. Didn't play well against Mizzou. All of these teams were seeded below us except maybe the Michigan game?
Baseball should be a powerhouse every year. We are one of the best programs annually in the nation and cream of the crop in the ACC. However, like this year we see our team go to Omaha as a 2 seed in the regional, knock off the number 1 seed, need only one win to make it to the Championship series and just forget how to hit against our rivals.
I just think people start to get tired of getting our hopes up every year that it's "our year" or we have the team to finally do it this year and get let down continually.
That being said I'm proud to be a Clemson Tiger and that will never change. I support each one of these teams and love this university, it is after all "God's country."
Just thought I'd try to answer some of your questions.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: Someone please explain something to me
Oct 6, 2010, 12:37 PM
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tiggerz I too have those same frustrations but I honestly believe our administration and athletic staff are top-notch and will continually improve our facilities, teams and university as a whole.
I don't need to nauseatingly berate them to show my frustration.
Point for the answers
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Die-Hard [8977]
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So, you choose to accent the negatives...
Oct 6, 2010, 12:40 PM
[ in reply to Re: Someone please explain something to me ] |
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instead of the positives. Instead of MAKING the College World Series as a #2 seed, and overcoming a mid-season swoon in the process, you obsess over losing to SC. Instead of overcoming the 2-3 start to make the ACC Championship game, you obsess over losing it. Whatever makes you feel better.
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110%er [6692]
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Whoa whoa whoa slow down there buddy.
Oct 6, 2010, 12:49 PM
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"That being said I'm proud to be a Clemson Tiger and that will never change. I support each one of these teams and love this university, it is after all 'God's country.'"
I was trying to give the perspective of what I hear other people saying to answer the original poster's questions.
I was #### proud of the football team last year too. I was at the GT game in Atlanta and told some smart a$$ GT fans that were mouthing off I'd see them in Tampa and I was there too. Also made it to the bowl game. I was in Auburn 3 weeks ago to support this team and was #### proud of how they played.
I was #### proud to make it to Omaha as the 2 seed. I was at every game in the Super Regional. And had I not had to work I would have been in Omaha. I never for once obsessed over losing it. I was proud of the team and honestly they surprised me by getting that far.
Now I am not a sunshine pumper and I will say there are some problems with our sports teams. However, I'm not a doom and gloomer that thinks we will never win again because of the AD, Barker, etc.
What I am is a proud Clemson Tiger and I wear my orange wherever I go with pride. I love this place and the quote from above from my original post was meant to show that.
And for the record I can understand the fact that no matter win or lose it is just a game played by my peers and is not a matter of life or death. Now I hate losing like hell because ###### I want to win. However, I feel lucky enough to be able to be in attendance at the games and at this great university. No amount of losing will change that or make me feel "bad."
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CU Guru [1660]
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Re: Whoa whoa whoa slow down there buddy.
Oct 6, 2010, 6:25 PM
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Well said. My life is most important, but Clemson is a close second.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Just as I thought. They respond with nothing
Oct 6, 2010, 12:34 PM
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Asked for reasons? they have none
Asked for qualifications? they have none
Asked for solutions? they have none
Instead of answering the questions, it's b1tchin, p1ssin and moanin about me daring to ask those questions.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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that's the point......
Oct 6, 2010, 12:45 PM
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it's a discussion board.........not an interview
NONE of us need qualifications to post opinions on a CLEMSON FOOTBALL discussion board.
Everybody has their own opinions not everybody agrees with those opinions.........like it or not it is what it is........if you hate the "pumpers" opinions don't read em.........if you hate the "realistic" opinions don't read em.........if you hate the "negative" opinions don't read em.
nobody's forcing you.........take all for what it is and deal with it rather than b!tchin and moanin' about b!tchin' and moanin'
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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I don't recall forcing you to respond to or read this post
Oct 6, 2010, 12:49 PM
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The problem is the b1tchin and moanin is out of hand. You have to wade through 90% of the posts on here to get to anything worth discussing.
Do you want your kids being negative or around negative people all the time?
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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you don't have to force me to respond......
Oct 6, 2010, 12:54 PM
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i don't mind responding to you.
I don't mind you having your opinion.
It's you that has a problem with others sharing those that differ from yours.
it's a discussion board......it's what it's meant for
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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you really call all the b1tchin discussion?
Oct 6, 2010, 1:05 PM
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as another poster said, glad I'm not around you at home.
There's a huge difference in maturely debating the negatives and positives of a game, coaching staff, administration or season without and 100% of the time getting on here and whining about something.
If you whine and b1tch 100% of the time, my original post was directed at you
If you get on here and actually discuss the issues, that's a different dog.
That's the point I'm making and many of those on here try to make.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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lol.....
Oct 6, 2010, 1:10 PM
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I'm just RESPONDING to YOUR post b!tchin' & moanin' about b!tchin & moanin'.........you brought it up not me.
you wanna have a mature discussion we can...........there's no excuse for us not to go 9-3 and beat USC this year.......AGREE? or Disagree?
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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absolutely agree and I'm thinking 10-2
Oct 6, 2010, 1:14 PM
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we've played the two best teams on our schedule and were in both games at the end.
I'm EXCITED about the rest of this season!
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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good we agree.......
Oct 6, 2010, 1:17 PM
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but i don't want to hear excuses should we go worse than 9-3 or 10-2 and/or lose to USC...........because there is none........agree?
my biggest frustration is that fans continually fall back on the same excuses that got our previous coach fired......dabo doesn't get a pass just because "he's not tommy".......IMO
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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god Pheebo,
Oct 6, 2010, 1:19 PM
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it truly sounds like you want to see our coaching staff fail.
What brought you to this point?
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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not the case at all........
Oct 6, 2010, 1:26 PM
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we fired Tommy who did EVERYTHING right.......except win enough (i think you'd agree)..........we hired to get BETTER RESULTS (i think you'd agree)........this program was NOT broken as a matter of fact we had more talent when dabo took over than we've had in a while (i think you'd agree).
I liked tommy, however his biggest downfall was he was too loyal to his coaches IMO.
TDP rolled the dice on an inexperienced coach at a BIGTIME football school......i want dabo to suceed more than anyone on here, but i don't wanna hear the same excuses when/if we don't reach the "next level"
dabo doesn't need time to rebuild a program.......he said it himself.....it ain't broken.
no excuse not to win NOW, sorry...........and definitely no excuse to lose to USC twice in a row.
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CU Guru [1799]
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CU Guru [1363]
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don't act as tho you actually wanted answers to those
Oct 6, 2010, 11:10 PM
[ in reply to Just as I thought. They respond with nothing ] |
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questions
your tone is clear, and it's clear you're complaining about complainers, so don't act like you want answers to questions you can't figure out answers to yourself
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CU Medallion [64621]
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Here's my take...
Oct 6, 2010, 12:51 PM
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There is no question that Clemson (along with the other state supported schools) struggles financially in large part because Clemson is located in a state that places a very low priority on public education which translates into the schools athletic endeavors. It's takes money, and alot of it, to run a very successful collegiate athletic program which is something Clemson simply doesn't have.
While I have not always agreed with his decisions, by and large, I think Terry Don Phillips is a reasonably effective Athletic Director. However, he is often compromised by the reality of the eronomic climate in which we find ourselves.
As an exmaple, I am not unhappy with the decisions to hire Dabo and Brownell. That said, neither one of them would have made the top five on a list of the best possible candidates. I firmly believe the decision to hire Dabo and Brownell was based largely on economics rather than experience or capabilities. I won't even get into the non-revenue sports.
TDP is not a bad Athletic Director but there is certainly significant room for improvement IMO particularly among the associate AD's on whom TDP relies heavily.
Just my take.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Great points
Oct 6, 2010, 12:57 PM
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I'm not "privy" enough to the activities of the assoc ADs to give an opinion on them. What I can only do is respond based on what I can see as TDP's overall success which I think is underrated.
The economics is without a doubt a contributing factor to the limitations I referred to in my post. We could've had a great top 5 list that we simply couldn't have got to Clemson not only from a financial aspect but numerous other possible reasons.
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CU Medallion [64621]
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"underrated" is not a word that is synonymous....
Oct 6, 2010, 1:15 PM
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with TDP's term as Clemson's athletic director IMO.
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All-TigerNet [10938]
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So then, you absolve TDP completely from the horrible
Oct 6, 2010, 1:46 PM
[ in reply to Here's my take... ] |
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buyout provisions in Tommy Bowden's contracts? TDP is the one that gave him a new contract with a huge buyout the Monday after 63-17. TDP is the one that gave Bowden a huge buyout after he floated rumors that he was going to Arkansas. TDP is the one that put us in the hole with Tommy Bowden, for the SOLE REASON that his last name was Bowden!!!
So if you are correct, and we hired Dabo because we didn't have the money to get Bud Foster or some other up and coming coach, then it was TDP who put us there!!!
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: So then, you absolve TDP completely from the horrible
Oct 6, 2010, 2:17 PM
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our being able to afford or not afford a coach had nothing to do with Tommy Bowden's buyout. The economics I'm speaking of make that number look miniscule.
As to the overall state of our athletics, TDP has done a good job.
But you're one of those that just want to p1ss and moan about him so I'm sure you'll continue with that.
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All-TigerNet [10938]
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So being on the hook for $4 million had no effect on our
Oct 6, 2010, 2:28 PM
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funding for football expenses (like coaches?) How is that possible?
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: So being on the hook for $4 million had no effect on our
Oct 6, 2010, 2:47 PM
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in 08-09 Clemson Football produced $46 million in revenue. That should increase a bit for 09-10. (haven't seen those numbers)
the school's entire budget is $800 million
Those numbers mean we could've hired about anyone with the exception of Saban to coach the Tigers.
The point is, it wasn't just about economics. There were numerous reasons mainly a very big one
Who wanted to come to Clemson?
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All-In [48018]
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While I agree with you 100%, I think the
Oct 6, 2010, 12:52 PM
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one thing that bothers most people is the alarming lack of championships, especially in the three major sports. If we are being honest with ourselves, the ACC in football has not exactly been a powerhouse the last few years so our lack of productivity there is extremely frustrating, not to mention somewhat puzzling when you consider all of the positives you mention in your post. It leads one to question what is wrong, and the simplest thing to do is to just point a finger at the coaches or administration. While I am certainly not in that camp, I can understand the feelings of those who are even though I refuse to live my life in that manner.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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and I am frustrated by a lack of championships as well
Oct 6, 2010, 1:00 PM
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but to continuously berate administrators at Clemson, our University, is ludicrous.
Tommy Bowden brought us along to a point and could not get us over that championship hump.
Give Dabo a chance to do it.
Thats my point
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All-In [48018]
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We agree again.
Oct 6, 2010, 1:48 PM
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I hope and believe Dabo is the right guy to get it done. However, I don't think he will be given the luxury of the long leash that Bowden got. Whether right or wrong, TB spoiled that for him.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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yep, you're correct on the leash
Oct 6, 2010, 2:01 PM
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I do think at a minimum it's a 5 years leash though.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Comes down to one thing - championships...
Oct 6, 2010, 12:57 PM
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Not ACCCG losers in football.
Basketball postseason = grease fire for years.
Baseball - NO ONE CARES.
Win us an ACC title in football or basketball PLEASE!
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110%er [5636]
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what's a championship?***
Oct 6, 2010, 12:58 PM
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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110%er [6692]
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Lots of people care about baseball.
Oct 6, 2010, 1:01 PM
[ in reply to Comes down to one thing - championships... ] |
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Take the Super Regional crowd, standing room only. See the crowd that traveled to Omaha, you know traveling costs money right?
And plenty of us students care about the basketball REGULAR season as well.
Just sayin'.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Uhhh - not really - and we are not winning chamionships
Oct 6, 2010, 1:03 PM
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there either.
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110%er [6692]
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Uhhh yeah really.
Oct 6, 2010, 1:05 PM
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Stop posting your uninformed, idiotic crap on this board. Yes I know you have YOUR opinion. But when you state "NO ONE CARES" about baseball you aren't stating YOUR opinion you are stating an opinion for the group as a whole and you are WRONG in that regard.
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Scout Team [173]
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Re: Uhhh yeah really.
Oct 6, 2010, 1:40 PM
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Yeah, I care about baseball too. To say "not really" is to makes ones opinions lack credibility.
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Die-Hard [8977]
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Oh yeah, "no one cares" about baseball...
Oct 6, 2010, 1:04 PM
[ in reply to Comes down to one thing - championships... ] |
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Clemson's only in the top 10 in the country in attendance, but "nobody cares". Aren't all your fans ecstatic with the National Championship in baseball?
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Rock Defender [54]
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Baseball is a distant third behind football and hoops...
Oct 6, 2010, 1:06 PM
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and compared to the interest in those two sports, baseball is miniscule.
Sorry - but that is reality.
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Die-Hard [8977]
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Ah, no it isn't...
Oct 6, 2010, 1:11 PM
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in fact, just a few years ago, there were more people at a mid-week Clemson baseball game than there were at the basketball NIT game the same day.
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Orange Blooded [2428]
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yeah, during your Larry Shyatt days maybe. Not since OP.***
Oct 6, 2010, 1:12 PM
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Die-Hard [8977]
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Actually, that year was AFTER coach Purnell arrived.***
Oct 6, 2010, 1:16 PM
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Rock Defender [54]
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Looks at average attendance for EVERY YEAR of Clemson
Oct 6, 2010, 1:18 PM
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athletics and let me know if baseball is more popular. You pick one random day and "speculate" that baseball might have had more people than an irrelevant NIT game had. Wow...
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Die-Hard [8977]
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How about look at average attendance...
Oct 6, 2010, 1:23 PM
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compared to the capacity of the facility. There's plenty of games where Littlejohn has LOTS of empty seats. And you'll NEVER convince me that Clemson basketball attendance is in the top 10 in the country.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Whatever man - keep on telling yourself baseball is relevant
Oct 6, 2010, 1:13 PM
[ in reply to Ah, no it isn't... ] |
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It is not.
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Die-Hard [8977]
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Really?...
Oct 6, 2010, 1:19 PM
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Your Gamecock brethren sure are excited about that National Championship. And yes, baseball IS relevant, regardless of what YOU think.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Relevant to you, but ALL POSSIBLE STATS show that it is
Oct 6, 2010, 1:23 PM
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less relevant than basketball and football.
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Die-Hard [8977]
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But that doesn't make it IRRELEVANT...
Oct 6, 2010, 1:25 PM
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and that doesn't mean that "nobody cares" about baseball.
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Enthusiast [130]
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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CU Medallion [64621]
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Abraham Lincoln said it best when he said....
Oct 6, 2010, 1:11 PM
[ in reply to Comes down to one thing - championships... ] |
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Tis better to be thought a fool and remain silent than to speak out and remove all doubt.
Words by which you should seriously consider living.
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110%er [5156]
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"Man, I've been dying to watch this play!"*
***
Oct 6, 2010, 1:13 PM
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Head Coach [759]
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Dabo has same winning % as the horrific 90s...
Oct 6, 2010, 2:00 PM
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How is that better shape?
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: Dabo has same winning % as the horrific 90s...
Oct 6, 2010, 2:09 PM
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From 1992-1999
5-6
9-3
5-6
8-4
7-5
7-5
3-8
6-6
totals 50-43
bowl record during that time 1-5
yes, horrific 90s
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Head Coach [759]
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Why not exclude 1993 while you're cherry picking?***
Oct 6, 2010, 4:50 PM
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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8 sequential years in the 90s is cherry picking?
Oct 6, 2010, 5:12 PM
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Maybe I could better suit your argument by putting DF's teams in that?
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Head Coach [759]
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It's simply lazy use of the English language.
Oct 6, 2010, 6:13 PM
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If you claim that the "90s" were horrific, then don't be mad when someone uses all 10 years of the decade instead of trying to guess how many years your definition encompasses.
While we are clarifying definitions, can you please clarify exactly which winning percentage is the cutoff for "horror" status? Based on your view of an 8 year decade and Dabo, I would assume it is between 54% and 60%, but I will leave the exact number to you.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: It's simply lazy use of the English language.
Oct 6, 2010, 9:04 PM
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are you really trying to be a d1ck about this?
I posted the years. From 92-99
3-8? 5-6? twice? 6-6?
THOSE are horrific years to me. But then, you already know that. You just want to be difficult. Much like several others on here.
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Head Coach [759]
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So which winning percentage is your cutoff for horrific?***
Oct 6, 2010, 11:33 PM
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: So which winning percentage is your cutoff for horrific?***
Oct 7, 2010, 6:41 AM
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I guess you are, just like most of your other posts.
It's not about winning percentage Homer.
it's about losing records or .500 records
it's about getting no respect not only in conference but even in state.
quit trying so hard to be a d1ck and actually respond to the post.
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CU Guru [1483]
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MIDOL works wonders....***
Oct 6, 2010, 6:09 PM
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CU Guru [1657]
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Just talking about wins and losses on the gridiron
Oct 7, 2010, 1:15 AM
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Some people just don't like losing. You seem to be okay with it.
The problem as I see it is that modern technology gives people a platform to express it to people other than those they work and tailgate with.
Also, several of your assumptions are WAY off.
I happen to really enjoy the atmosphere at our games, but top 5 is a big stretch. Especially since I just saw empty corners in the stadium with my own two eyes on Saturday.
You want to call Clemson one of the best Universities in the country, because it helps you make your argument. Yet, the reality is, that's hyperbole at best. The last report I saw had us ranked around 150-200.
Good school, no doubt. Great football atmosphere - a couple times a year. Horribly mediocre football program relative to the resources and environment we provide.
Wait a second. I think we just made each others point.
To paraphrase my friend who came for his third visit to Clemson over the past 15 years - 'You guys have it all here, why is it that you have to choke EVERY SINGLE YEAR... I just don't understand it.'
That's how the world thinks of Clemson. And that bothers some of us.
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Orange Blooded [4718]
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Re: Just talking about wins and losses on the gridiron
Oct 7, 2010, 6:37 AM
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I'm not at all ok with losing
I would hope that NO Clemson fan is ok with losing to Auburn and Miami. But that had nothing to do with my post.
I've seen countless lists of tailgating/gameday experiences with Clemson in the top 5. The links have been posted here on tnet many times. But, it's not about that.
It's about the non-stop complaining that many on this board take part in every week, especially after losses. Many of them ONLY post after a loss and the others simply do nothing but complain.
It's much like that wife that does nothing but nag. I'd want to divorce her too. I'm so fortunate to have one that doesn't nag at all but should she start like the nags on here, I'd probably have alot more to say to her than what I've posted.
Constant griping, p1ssing, moaning, b1tching is mind-numbingly annoying. THAT is the point of my post.
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Orange Blooded [4741]
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People who constantly harp on the negativity
Oct 7, 2010, 8:55 AM
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perpetuate the negativity.
I'm not a "sunshine pumper" and I'm not a "negative Nancy." I come here for intelligent discussion of Tiger athletics.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion on here, so long as it is presented constructively. But I do think that these posts only stoke the flames of the hardcore defeatists, who have more energy and stamina in their vocal minority than the rest of us have put together.
Me? I just want what's best for Clemson. And a Conference Title...
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Orange Blooded [4718]
TigerPulse: 100%
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We want the same tomera
Oct 7, 2010, 9:22 AM
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sick and tired of all the negative bs though.
constantly complain without any constructive contribution
If you were physically around someone like these clowns would you continue to be around them?
Would you let them know how annoying they are?
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