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110%er [7179]
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Walk Through Two Super-Conferences!
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Aug 5, 2023, 8:35 PM
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If what I am hearing is correct; "people have a fear that unless you are in a super conference college team will not be able to compete for the National Championship. Due to a plethora of reasons like, but not limited to revenue sharing being larger in the Sup-CF, resources, therefore, will be larger and those schools will get all the best players, right, no money for the teams will be left because it will all be gobbled up with sup-cf teams, etc.!
I get all that. If you are one that believes the above things plus more will happen; walk me through what you think will happen with all the other football-playing schools, please!
Are you thinking everybody else will get squeezed out as a G5 team does now; because your schedule won't be good enough? Do you think with an expanded playoff, the powers that be would still take a non-sup-cf team and ignore let's say an undefeated season? Do you think the two(the way it appears now eventually) sup-cf will break from the NCAA?
My thought is: people are going to watch and support football pretty much on any and every level. Those other schools will suddenly not have an alumni base when the sup-cf forms.
In S.C. High School football you have 5A through 1A champions annually. I can promise you there have been many years where the 3A champ could very likely have beaten the 5A champ. I can also promise you - neither team cared about the other classifications' claim to a championship.
If they break from the NCAA - the rest of college football might get more interesting "Who knows"! Because it won't be about who has the biggest alumni/supporter base. It will be about who can field the best team - "IF" all things are more or less equal.
There are some teams that will end up in the Sup-CF who "DANG sure have never done anything on the football field to have earned the right to compete for the S-C National Title. In fact, I suspect there are some schools(Vandy, NW, Purdue, etc.) that would probably drop down so they could maybe have a shot one day, LOL"! Because, despite their huge revenue making truth over say a school like Clemson - as a random non-specific example; "they have done little to nothing in football in terms of fielding a competitive team"! Do you all think all of a sudden Northwestern and Purdue and Vanderbilt and South Carolina and Mississippi State will suddenly get whoever Bama, Ohio St, LSU, etc. picks over?
In your mind, do they still get 4 years of eligibility unless they RS? What other rules would change?
The fact was when we beat LSU, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Notre Dame, and Alabama in recent years they had better recruits(composite). Larger athletic department budgets. And far more resources than Clemson. Yet!
Anyhow; just wondering if there are several angles, I haven't considered. Because what I am hearing kind of suggests all the G5 schools should have shut down football and athletic programs years ago. It won't be over until it's over. I think there could be a time when some of the worst-case scenarios happen. But, things will change in other ways before then. X-years ago; who would have predicted the transfer portal or NIL deals changing the landscape? Will people still have the same appetite for the sport if basically, it's miniature NFL( Super - Conference I am referring to)?
You hear it all the time: "The kids on that level play for the love of the game, not because of money. That's why I don't support the NFL because of the money"! Well, sorry ma'am/sir, if that's your stance will you still follow what people are predicting for college football still?
Just questions~
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All-TigerNet [12547]
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Will just be a level between the big two and FCS. You will
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Aug 5, 2023, 9:08 PM
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not be able to get the players necessary to compete at the the top level. Pay for play is coming. It is not far away. That is what all of this is about.
For the record, if the SEC and Big continue to expand, I do think Clemson can land in one or the other in certain situations. In spite of my nail biting and concerns, I think Clemson can land in the SEC if they go to 20 teams, but not 18. I think we can land in the BIG if they go to 24 teams, but not 20. So, we have to hope that the big 2 will expand to at least 24 teams, or 20 if SEC. That may be some years away, as we let the penalty to leave get less severe and have less years remaining. Neither of those two conferences are going to mess with us with that potentially messy and expensive divorce looming.
The FSU chairman of BOT said the GOR would absolutely not be the reason they would not be able to leave. I'd like to know why he feels that way. They are talking loans and so forth. I don't think Clemson will be brave enough to do that, and not sure that is the answer.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Will just be a level between the big two and FCS. You will
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Aug 5, 2023, 10:49 PM
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Thanks!
Would the level the two big conferences be in; be considered "college football" then? Or do you think the NCAA is going to go: "hey, unless you are in one of these two conferences, no matter how good your team is if you don't make the top 6 in one of these two conferences, you don't get a chance"?
If that's the case, and the "best players go to one of those schools" then wouldn't the NCAA at that point be forced to acknowledge the rest of the field?
Call it the current Group of 5. To me much of the anxiety that's going on would go away if there was another level championship within the NCAA.
It's basically what people "insist" is the case. If they have more money and more resources, they automatically win.
Clemson has proven that wrong multiple times; so I don't subscribe to that so much. But, for the sake of everyone else, let's say only "the schools who have large resources, money and support" get a chance in the mega conference.
You couldn't now go, hey okay everyone who wasn't in FCS you are now relegated to FCS.
No.
I think what will happen; you will have a Best of the schools who do not have limitless resources championship! Probably what we call the NCAA National Championship currently. As many people speculate that the mega conference teams will want to separate themselves from the NCAA.
Big question to me would be: "if they would limit themselves to 85 scholarship players"? If so, there is still only going to be so many players who can go to these schools. Every week if you watch the NFL, you will see plenty small school kids on NFL rosters.
Tiny SC State at one point a couple years ago had 5 active players in the league. So, players are still going to be available. Kids are still going to want to play football.
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110%er [7179]
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It Could End Up More Popular!
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Aug 5, 2023, 11:02 PM
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Once the veil of "amateurism" has left fully - the marketplace could change!
People could start pulling their support.
Currently, if people think their team has a chance to compete they are interested in other teams! To see how their school's team stacks up. If that isn't an option, just watch the programs that could prevent you from getting to "your level National Championship"!
I'd be willing to bet a slug out of my garden that each poster on tnet could name at least two people who do not support the NFL. Or they themselves do not support it. #1 reason for that lack of support seems to be the perception "of NFL players being spoiled and not passionate due to the money"!
Let the NIL money particulars start getting out. I would bet some of the general viewing public would find something else to support and put their time and money into. Over time it will have an effect as people burn out from it.
The NFL isn't worried about the folks who do not watch; because it's such a popular sport. Plus, it's not trying to act like it's about the "Student-Athlete" and "School-Spirit"! And, are located in cities that can support it, even when the team isn't doing well. And, there are only 32 teams to contend with in the 1st place.
Will the Sup-CF follow the model in people's minds like pro sports for "small market cities" and have a salary cap? That way, the playing field is level.
People want NFL - College football -but I don't think all the finer details will fly with the people who are expected to poor Millions of dollars into broadcasting games.
Perhaps, the more exciting, NCAA teams who aren't in the Sup-CF are more popular because they are more enthusiastic and about the right things, LOL! I.E. why college football is said to be more popular by some people ( not me and not by other ways either ) than the NFL.
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Freshman [-100]
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Re: It Could End Up More Popular!
Aug 6, 2023, 2:49 PM
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The NFL will do just fine. Many more fans than for college football nationwide. College football attendence is dropping and with this will continue. TV rating for college games have begun to fall. This will increase the slide. The worst is yet to come
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110%er [7179]
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Re: It Could End Up More "Unpopular"!
Aug 6, 2023, 4:24 PM
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I meant to say unpopular in my first post above.
You are correct; I am afraid.
People have a real issue sometimes with what they perceive to be spoiled, unappreciative players! Wait until they get a load of 18-22 Y.O. who have grown up in a society where everybody gets a trophy.
The people thinking about tomorrow with today's rules and points of view need to stop and think about it. It gets to a point of privilege for the biggest and more financed; I think the fans in states where their team isn't involved will stop caring. It's already happening to an extent; because west coast teams can't seem to win National Championships suddenly. Heck, they can barely make it to the playoffs. And, now people are suggesting a construct of entire states' eyeballs and TV viewership will be able to sustain itself without support from whole states.
Maybe for a while. But, it's not going to be sustainable!
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All-In [48374]
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Re: Will just be a level between the big two and FCS. You will
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Aug 5, 2023, 11:11 PM
[ in reply to Re: Will just be a level between the big two and FCS. You will ] |
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I get what you're saying but imo the g5 would be like fcs is now. They're loaded with kids that, as you pointed out, love playing football. Occasionally you get some that make pro. But you'll never have enough to compete with the big boys. So yes fans would still go buy tickets but at reduced prices. Still have passion for Clemson, just wouldn't be the same level.
Kinda like watching the usfl or whatever they're calling it now vs NFL. Nah, if we're not part of big boy football, then I'd lose interest.
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110%er [7179]
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Almost Collusion i.m.o. then.
Aug 6, 2023, 1:01 PM
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ClemGalAlways - I get it. I would maybe be disappointed. But, I can tell you from experiencing this at a lower level of football; it won't matter to you "over time"!
At the H.S. level sometimes schools change levels( 5A - 1A). I remember being dropped a level due to being bumped out by schools across the state with larger enrollment. We win the State championship and it really didn't matter! The folks in 5A who won could walk/talk/speculate like they could beat everybody on the field - but common opinion was we would wax(dominate) the 5A champ.
Note: I didnt mention names; as I am not making this post about that situation.
The point being: if everything happens like many of the dooms day posters are suggesting; it might be a reality until we have a opportunity to "get in".
I just still contend we will never have the alumni or support system of Ohio State, Texas, Florida, Georgia or a Michigan. If it's all about the money; much like the stars in recruiting - why even play the games then? By the logic I keep hearing; "it's a done deal because of the support system, money generated, resources, star rated players, etc". I just know better than that.
Disadvantage maybe - but Kentucky, SCAR, Vandy, NW, Maryland, Purdue, Nebraska, Illinois, Iowa, Rutgers,etc. are not going to suddenly be "Football Schools" who garner all the best players!
Everyone is assumming the TV money is going to stay the same. Could be it doesn't and suddenly; TV starts looking for something less expensive to broadcast that still has a ton of TV viewership! And, yep, I am talking about the schools who would be left out. Because many of these schools aren't exactly small or have "no following" in their own right!
Which is where it's very much different than FCS.
If the "big boys" aren't playing by the rules and split from the NCAA then they basically are semi-pro. What happens to the facade that the kids are there for an education then as a side question from these conferences?
I just would have to see it happen like people think; before I believe it. There are several factors I never see people mention. And, a lot of assuming things are going to be exactly how they are now, and they won't. It's like a case study in human behavior. When pro sports strikes; they lose viewership. Baseball a few decades ago really hurt itself with a lockout.
People will change their opinion; I think as details start emerging with some of the crazy money being thrown around.
Thanks everyone for your input.
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110%er [7179]
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Unlike UCF; No Clemson or FSU. Means less perception
Aug 6, 2023, 1:38 PM
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Clemson went through SEC and Big 10 squads to win National titles on the field: no voted-on rubbish.
FSU beat Auburn on the field to win a National Championship in 2013.
Not having teams that have proven they can compete; would be watered down and people across the country would call them on it.
Particularly if Clemson and FSU field great teams.
Unless they go to a system whereby they do not platoon and have more than 11 at a time on offense and defense. There will be players available. Given that the players aren't paid directly by the school; but by 3rd parties - shouldn't the divide have already shown itself?
These kids will still want to make it to the league! And, they will still not want to go to a place where they are not treated well.
Clemson and FSU and some other prominent schools that have played for or won National Titles are not going to be like current G5 schools.
The people will make it happen. The doubt will creep in and make it happen.
Pittsburgh Panthers football has 9 claimed National Championships and people are suggesting - they wouldn't get a shot and be relegated to current G5 status. Same with us(Clemson) and FSU and Miami(5 National Titles). Heck, I think Georgia Tech has at least 1 or more themselves.
Money for the athletic department means more money for non-revenue sports and better leather for the student lounge. It does not necessarily mean, they will get better players. Money is money and the opportunity to reach the league at football schools(even if they are squeezed out of the big two) is still going to have it's place!
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