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110%er [5484]
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How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:03 AM
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I believe CBB is under contract through 2026. I am no expert on these things but I would say he's extended through 2029.
I have never been a big Brad fan but 2 sweet 16's in six years should earn him a good extension. It will be interesting what we offer and if others come after him.
If you're him, can you really accomplish any more here? On the other hand, he seems to have put down roots. I think it's natural to do some self reflection at his age. I know I did...
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Oculus Spirit [80426]
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Hopefully we can lock him up with a lifetime extension. Neff better not blow it.***
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:05 AM
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110%er [6982]
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Re: Hopefully we can lock him up with a lifetime extension. Neff better not blow it.***
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:21 AM
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He already has one apparently.
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All-In [30460]
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All-In [44054]
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How do you know?
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:49 AM
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I didn't realize we had any fortune tellers here on TNet.
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110%er [5483]
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Re: How do you know?
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:52 AM
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The past 14 years is a good predictor of the future.
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110%er [8003]
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Re: How do you know?
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:01 AM
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The past 14 years is a good predictor of the future.
Somewhat true but we now have a remodeled LJ, have a proposed basketball facility on the table, have stepped up assistant salaries and upped our NIL game. So the landscape for the past couple of years and looking forward is much different than the early years where we had to hide our facilities from recruits.
I guess it is not surprising you overlooked these items since it does not fit the LF narrative.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: How do you know?
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:18 AM
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All that was in place before the last Sweet Sixteen and we got one year with no postseason, two NITs, a one and done NCAA, and a Covid year that we probably wouldn’t have even made the NIT (we were one game over .500 with a 10th place NET in the ACC). So we should lock this in on rinse and repeat?
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All-TigerNet [13530]
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Re: How do you know?
Dec 1, 2011, 11:43 PM
[ in reply to Re: How do you know? ] |
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Dabo says you're welcome...
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Recruit [89]
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Re: How do you know?
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:17 AM
[ in reply to Re: How do you know? ] |
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I will never follow Clemson basketball again. it's so ill relevant. Let BB do his average thing forever. The football program is where I cast my lots on. They're the National Brand for Clemson. No other sports program for Clemson is.
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All-TigerNet [13530]
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Re: How do you know?
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:56 AM
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I wouldn't disagree with you about football carrying the banner, but living in the West, I would say the brand is enhanced when Clemson performs well in sports other than football. This year has been exceptional so far:
NC in Men's Soccer
Final 4 in Women's Soccer
Top 20 in Football
Women's Gymnastics finishes 2nd in the ACC and makes the NCAAT in its first year
Ranked teams in Softball and LAX
Currently #2 in Baseball
Sweet 16 in Basketball and hoping for more
A good indoor track season
Beat SC jr in the 3 major sports
I may have missed someone but the point is the collective accomplishments travel well when it comes to our national footprint. Not everyone is as football centric as the SE...
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CU Guru [1121]
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Youre a big fan of history.
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:00 AM
[ in reply to How do you know? ] |
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So what about 14 years of data, with only 3 top 40 finishes. Seems we have a lot of historical data to pull from?
This roster will be SEVERELY depleted next year. You expect the same team? Really?
This is like Tommy Bowden in 2003. Makes a run to save his job, but the real coaching performance will ultimately come to the top.
Hopefully Brad has matured at his job and can find a team remotely like this year. I hope, but I do have some doubts. And that’s reasonable based on recorded performance.
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Letterman [275]
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Re: Youre a big fan of history.
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:15 AM
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So its great to have our team play this well and make it to the sweet 16. If we actually did something more than that, I would be all about giving him the extensions. Unfortunately, the same predictions still stand, we won't win the ACC in regular season, we won't win the ACC tournament, and we won't ever make it past the sweet 16 once we get in tournament in the years we do get into the tournament. I will give credit that at least we didn't go one in done, that was somewhat unexpected. I will cheer team on Thursday and hope for a win, would love to eat crow, but we seem to be content with a sweet 16 appearance very 6 years, mixed in with a whole bunch of one and dones. I cant tell you how much I hope to be proven wrong Thursday
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Legend [18792]
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I am with you but also hope to be proven wrong. Go Tigers!!***
Mar 27, 2024, 11:22 AM
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All-In [44054]
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I know it bothers you that
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:44 AM
[ in reply to Youre a big fan of history. ] |
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men's basketball is on an upward trajectory while the football program is on a downward trajectory.
So rather than looking at where we are right now, you default to "the last 14 years."
We are a different program now. We are recruiting better (top 25 class for 2024). We are one of the top programs in the ACC the last two years.
We certainly seem to have some big shoes to fill for next year, but at this point we don't even know who is coming back. Let's see what PJ, Chase, and Hemenway decide to do. Let's see if we lose any guys to the portal. Let's see who we get in the portal. Let's see how the young guys, including redshirts (Heidbreder, Thomas) and incoming freshmen do.
LOTS of variables that haven't been determined yet. No need to predict doom and gloom at this point.
Remember, at this point last year, everyone was worried about losing Hunter Tyson. He was a big loss for sure, but we got Girard and Clark from the portal and they have both been huge for us this year.
I believe we have a chance to be good next year. Different for sure, but still good. In this day and age, every team will be different. That's okay.
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Oculus Spirit [80426]
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It was rock bottom, so yes it would have to be an upward trajectory. lol***
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:55 AM
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Re: I know it bothers you that
Mar 27, 2024, 12:38 PM
[ in reply to I know it bothers you that ] |
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men's basketball is on an upward trajectory while the football program is on a downward trajectory.
So rather than looking at where we are right now, you default to "the last 14 years."
We are a different program now. We are recruiting better (top 25 class for 2024). We are one of the top programs in the ACC the last two years.
We certainly seem to have some big shoes to fill for next year, but at this point we don't even know who is coming back. Let's see what PJ, Chase, and Hemenway decide to do. Let's see if we lose any guys to the portal. Let's see who we get in the portal. Let's see how the young guys, including redshirts (Heidbreder, Thomas) and incoming freshmen do.
LOTS of variables that haven't been determined yet. No need to predict doom and gloom at this point.
Remember, at this point last year, everyone was worried about losing Hunter Tyson. He was a big loss for sure, but we got Girard and Clark from the portal and they have both been huge for us this year.
I believe we have a chance to be good next year. Different for sure, but still good. In this day and age, every team will be different. That's okay.
I can you call a program that will be preseason top 12 downward trajectory?
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110%er [8054]
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Re: 3 years, reduce the buy out, small raise.
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:23 AM
[ in reply to 3 years, reduce the buy out, small raise. ] |
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in the last 6 years he has taken us to two sweet sixteens and been royally screwed out of another March Madness appearance (last year). Who knows what we would have done in the tournament last year.
Making the tournament 50% of the time in the last 6 years (which it should have been0 and making the sweet 16 1/3 of the time in the last 6 years is hard to argue against.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: 3 years, reduce the buy out, small raise.
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:37 AM
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It’s seven seasons, not six. And he didn’t make the tourney last year, so that fluf is meaningless. In seven seasons he has made 3 tourneys, one no postseason, 2 nits, and a Covid year.
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Orange Blooded [4069]
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All-In [44054]
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The rest of the ACC coaches hate playing us.
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:45 AM
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You do realize that we are a tough out for everyone, right?
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All-In [30460]
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I would imagine thats true until the ACC tournament and then they
Mar 27, 2024, 12:08 PM
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Want to face us
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Commissioner [924]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:11 AM
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5 year extension coming.
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110%er [5395]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 12:54 PM
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I don’t know how many years are left on his current contract but, Brad needs five years on his contract for recruiting purposes.
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110%er [5961]
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If Brad can help our Tigers bring home a National Championship
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:20 AM
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then anything is on the table IMO.
If the Tigers go no further and lose to Arizona in the Sweet 16 how can you even consider moving on to someone else ??
14+ years, 2 Sweet 16 appearances. Not exactly great but Clemson has never had a good basketball program. Some success here and there but depending on your definition of success then maybe some would feel it underachieving. It is a difficult call and I think this team has helped Brad earn more time here at Clemson and hopefully the taste of success this year will drive this Clemson team into the future with higher goals and accomplishments.
The players seem to like Brownell, especially after that victory Sunday they had some vitriol to spread to the non-believers and haters of Brownell. That is nice to see, that team has his back because players do not do that unless it is warranted.
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Orange Blooded [2483]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:47 AM
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2029 when a reasonable buyout. Tons of incentives too. I think he is turning the corner and that the NIL is great for him.
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Heisman Winner [134658]
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I hope he does well enough to warrant a nice contract.
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:53 AM
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That means Clemson does well from here on out.
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All-TigerNet [11487]
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I think you have to look at the last 7 years as an indicator
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Mar 27, 2024, 9:58 AM
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Two sweet sixteens, another ncaat, and two nits.
I woukdn't go crazy on the extension. 3 years added, moderate raise, and buyout about the same.
Neff is no idiot, and has to also look at the 14 years as a whole that there are no guarantees under Coach Brownell.
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110%er [5484]
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Re: I think you have to look at the last 7 years as an indicator
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:00 AM
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I think that’s a reasonable prediction
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All-In [30839]
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"can you really accomplish any more here?"
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:02 AM
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"can you really accomplish any more here?"
nope.
Clemson has reached the pinnacle of men's basketball success. Clemson should Barry Sanders the program.
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All-In [26035]
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Re: "can you really accomplish any more here?"
Mar 27, 2024, 10:03 AM
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Just like Tommy Bowden.
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110%er [5484]
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Re: "can you really accomplish any more here?"
Mar 27, 2024, 10:31 AM
[ in reply to "can you really accomplish any more here?" ] |
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What I meant GT is “can he accomplish anymore here?”
We were at a pretty elite level with Barnes.
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All-In [44054]
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LOL we were not at an elite level under Barnes.
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:54 AM
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We never finished higher than 4th place in a 9 team ACC.
Our ACC record was well below .500 under Rick.
We were 13-27 against ranked teams while Barnes was our coach.
We had the one nice NCAA Tournament run to the Sweet 16, but were one and done in the NCAA Tournament otherwise, including one of the most disappointing and underachieving Clemson basketball teams ever in 97-98. We had a senior Greg Buckner, junior Terrell McIntyre, junior Harold Jamison, junior Tony Christie, and some other good role players (Wideman, Whitt, Iturbe, Miller, etc.) and we went 6-8 in our final 14 games of the season including a huge upset loss to Western Michigan in the first round of the NCAA Tournament.
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110%er [5484]
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Re: LOL we were not at an elite level under Barnes.
Mar 27, 2024, 12:35 PM
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95 was a barren year. 96 was a much better year. We were consistently ranked in the top 10, reaching number 2. We beat a great Kentucky team to start the year. Barnes had us where we've never been before or since.
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110%er [7167]
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My hunch is if BB gets further than we think he'll get offered another gig and
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:04 AM
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will fly the coop.
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All-TigerNet [11487]
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Re: My hunch is if BB gets further than we think he'll get offered another gig and
Mar 27, 2024, 10:31 AM
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will fly the coop.
If you are really still on the negative spectrum of Brad Brownell then you want this wave of success to continue. Indiana will not keep Mike Woodson not much longer of not making the NCAAT, if Brad can find away to get back to the Dance next year, and timing is right he could be a big candidate there if look at the last 7 years, or other places.
Now, the only thing stopping that is if Coach Brownell is content at Clemson and his ego tells him he can be the legacy coach.
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All-TigerNet [11487]
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Orange Blooded [2078]
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All-TigerNet [13530]
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Re: Indiana will always be his dream job
Mar 27, 2024, 11:00 AM
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He's no Bobby Knight but neither is Woodson...
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Oculus Spirit [80426]
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Recruit [89]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
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Mar 27, 2024, 10:11 AM
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Clemson will NEVER be an ELITE program in basketball under BB. As long BB keeps doing enough to barely get by. Old crafty Brad Brownell has learned how to "hustle" Clemson ADs. Schedule cupcakes early, have a .500 record in the ACC, and have 20-12 average records every year. The Baylor win got him the extension he wanted, but it has doomed Clemson basketball to 10 more years of "middle -of-the-road torment.
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All-TigerNet [13530]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
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Mar 27, 2024, 11:02 AM
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Clemson will never be an ELITE program under anyone unless and until the administration has a change of heart and decides to put forth the extra effort and dollars to build it.
I do like the recent commitments and think that is a step in the right direction but getting to ELITE requires a major commitment and prioritization that I don't believe currently exists.
Message was edited by: slwcu79®
Message was edited by: slwcu79®
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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This is likely accurate
Mar 27, 2024, 11:54 AM
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I think the odds are quite high that, even if we did manage to replace Brad with a really, really good coach that's capable of taking Clemson basketball to the next level, that could would likely leave for a bigger job ala Barnes.
That's not to say that we shouldn't try, but Clemson is going to be treated as a stepping stone job until the financial and fan support catch up to some of these high expectations for Clemson basketball.
It's either that or take a shot at throwing some money at a coach with some baggage and a sullied reputation like Kelvin Sampson or Bruce Pearl. Do we really want to stoop to Auburn's level though?
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All-In [27344]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:16 AM
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No extensions. Make every year a contract year. Brownell seems to have the most successful season when his chair is on fire. Keep the fire lit and maybe we'll see some sustainable success.
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CU Guru [1697]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:24 AM
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I think an extension to 2029 is reasonable and probable unless he does something outstanding in this tournament and it warrants more.
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All-TigerNet [11030]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:27 AM
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I don't know why schools have to rush to give contract extensions everytime a coach does what he/she was hired to do in the first place!
You certainly don't see coaches getting contract reductions when they fail. They may get fired, but they still get paid.
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110%er [5484]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:32 AM
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Yep
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110%er [5262]
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14 years and 50% interest in Littlejohn...
Mar 27, 2024, 10:34 AM
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that ought to do it
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110%er [5262]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:35 AM
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how old are brownells kids? how many does he have?
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All-TigerNet [11487]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:41 AM
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Has two daughters graduated from Clemson so that is not any concern...
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All-TigerNet [10924]
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Re: How long of an extension does Neff give Brownell
Mar 27, 2024, 10:41 AM
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Has any coach ever gotten a lifetime contract? That's the dumbest move ever.
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All-In [32656]
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56 hundred eleven . . . . that should suffice . . . .***
Mar 27, 2024, 11:15 AM
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CU Medallion [65528]
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Trying to be objective, I would give him a raise to $3,500,000 a year in salary.
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Mar 27, 2024, 12:24 PM
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That would put him sixth among ACC coaches, which matches our finish in the conference this year, and is a VERY nice 26.7% raise. Extension wise, I would give him two more years, through the 2028 season. That would run until any players coming in as freshmen for next year are out of eligibility, barring redshirts. I would put certain guidelines / goals in, that if met, would result in a yearly rollover of the extension. (Number of wins, finish position in the conference, etc)
I would LOWER the buyout to less than a million, maybe to $800,000. He is receiving almost that much of a bump in base salary in my scenario. I want to protect Clemson University in case next season turns out to be a fallback disaster. The last thing I want to see is a repeat of the same mistake the school made with Tommy Bowden, one good (For HIM) year, gives a big shiny new contract, huge buyout, and then BOOM, the wheels fall off and we are on the hook for $$$ to be rid of the mistake.
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All-TigerNet [11487]
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Re: Trying to be objective, I would give him a raise to $3,500,000 a year in salary.
Mar 27, 2024, 12:36 PM
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Except now he has two good years 7 years apart tho.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: Trying to be objective, I would give him a raise to $3,500,000 a year in salary.
Mar 27, 2024, 12:52 PM
[ in reply to Trying to be objective, I would give him a raise to $3,500,000 a year in salary. ] |
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He’s already 3rd in base salary. He’s lower in some rankings because they use total compensation, which includes bonuses. Brad does NOT need more base salary. He needs stronger, high level incentives. If Brad outlasts his rival ACC coaches he could very well be the 2nd highest paid coach in the ACC this year. We have to get away from the perception that he is working on a shoe string. Scheyer is the wildcard because no one actually knows what he makes. Reports day $9 million but that makes no sense. Why would he be almost 3/4 of K’s total annual compensation? Why would you start anyone there? I can believe that he has an incentive laden contract that maxes at $9 million if he wins ACC and NCAA titles.
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Heisman Winner [140588]
TigerPulse: 100%
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It should be year to year, unless
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Mar 27, 2024, 12:38 PM
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We win the ACCT, then he gets 4 years, or we win the NCAAT, then it would be 6 years.
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Legend [16921]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 1/25/07
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Re: It should be year to year, unless
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Mar 27, 2024, 12:46 PM
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This actually seems completely practical which isn’t in most ADs playbook. If Neff presented and Brownell agreed to a rolling 3 year deal (he proved that 3 years isn’t an impediment in recruiting or in using the portal this season) that had no increase in base salary but added ample bonuses for high achievement (no more NIT bonuses) I would be genuinely impressed with both parties. I’m open to the idea that the portal is a niche Brownell has some innate ability to work with. But I also don’t want to be married to him and have the next 5 years be like the last 5.
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All-Conference [415]
TigerPulse: 72%
Posts: 629
Joined: 11/14/14
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wait till next year to do extension, if he gets to another Sweet 16, 5 yrs more
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Mar 27, 2024, 12:57 PM
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but i would not do this year, no matter how it impacts recruiting
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