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110%er [7179]
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Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 10, 2024, 10:29 PM
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Garrett Riley coached two years at SMU - with Sonny Dykes.
He coached 1 year at TCU - with Sonny Dykes.
My question: Dykes was doing well on offense before Riley. He did well on offense with Riley. But, last year despite losing a ton of production, TCU was still a very good offensive team.
I think Lincoln's little bro may have assisted him at some stops; but was never the OC. I know ECU is where he and Kyle Richardson 1st met.
Are we once again being hoodwinked by the "big name in CFB = Riley"?
I think maybe so. Dykes has moved the ball at pretty much every stop prior to Riley joining his staff. Is Clemson where he gets to learn and figure things out "100% on his own and we just have to live with the growning pains"?
Not making any assumptions. Just wondering if anybody else has thought about that, really! See below. I attached last year TCU stats w/o all those players that left. Still ranked 10th in total offense.
I also attached Coach Riley's coaching stops. Hmmm. It doesn't state it; but when you see SMU as OC understand Dykes was there as well.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/stats/team
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garrett_Riley
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Legend [17312]
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That is the $2,1 mm per year question?***
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Apr 10, 2024, 10:43 PM
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All-American [580]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 10, 2024, 10:48 PM
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No. He is better than Sonny Dykes. The first 2 years Venables was hired at Clemson people were asking the same question about him.
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Athletic Dir [871]
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This isn't a knock on Riley, but he's no Sonny Dykes, at least not yet. Dykes is
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Apr 11, 2024, 7:03 AM
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widely regarded as one of the top offensive minds in college football over the last couple decades. He's proven it time and time again. Riley is just now getting his chance to shine on his own, so maybe in 15 years we look back and have a different answer but no he is NOT better than Sonny Dykes.
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CU Guru [1045]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 10, 2024, 11:02 PM
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He's as good as the players he has.
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110%er [5093]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 10:28 AM
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Wise and true words Kemosabe.
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Legend [17806]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 12, 2024, 12:17 PM
[ in reply to Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes? ] |
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That is what made Saban a great coach first and foremost. And he said so himself. He was the best recruiter and got the best players. Made the rest a bit easier.
And yes, “The Year” when TCU made the four team post season invitational CFP tournament to determine the CFP champion - overall the skill players were better on TCU than Clemson recently. Hence why we haven’t sniffed an invitation to the four team post season invitational CFP tournament to determine the CFP champion.
Just glad that it is now a twelve team post season invitational CFP tournament to determine the CFP champion
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110%er [8594]
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Since we're gonna base everything off of one year
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Apr 10, 2024, 11:18 PM
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How did Dykes do last year at TCU?
He had a losing record at 5-7 and 206 fewer yards per game than the previous year.
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Head Coach [771]
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Re: Since we're gonna base everything off of one year
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Apr 11, 2024, 6:10 AM
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He lost an All American QB and a AA RB from Mt. Enterprise Texas...one in HS there who broke all the records as a sophomore!
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110%er [8594]
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And in 2022 he inherited an AA QB and AA RB both of whom he did not develop
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Apr 11, 2024, 6:57 AM
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While being the head coach at SMU the previous year. You could argue that he was born on third base in '22. Again when you base your whole argument on one year it's easy to spin whichever way you want.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Since we're gonna base everything off of one year
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Apr 11, 2024, 12:04 PM
[ in reply to Since we're gonna base everything off of one year ] |
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How did Dykes do last year at TCU?
He had a losing record at 5-7 and 206 fewer yards per game than the previous year.
Please, go back to my original post.
I have a link on there that indicates how well "TCU's OFFENSE" did without G. Riley.
Hint: "they finished 10th in the country"!
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110%er [5089]
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Re: I'm Just Waiting On The Creativity Aspect From Garrett ---
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Apr 10, 2024, 11:35 PM
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I just don't buy the not having the right players to run a random Garrett Riley play excuse. Dabo needs to add to that playbook with Riley and not have Riley run Dabo/Morris's plays all the time. Blend some things together and make it difficult for these defenses.
Against Georgia....we are going to need to be explosive all game long.
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CU Guru [1045]
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Re: I'm Just Waiting On The Creativity Aspect From Garrett ---
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Apr 11, 2024, 12:22 PM
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That would require player who are explosive. Hopefully some of the new guys are just that.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: I'm Just Waiting On The Creativity Aspect From Garrett ---
Apr 11, 2024, 12:40 PM
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You do have to have "explosive players"! But, a lot of it requires good play design as well. It's hard to get me to believe some of these teams who are not at Clemson's level as it relates to recruiting; can be explosive: "yet we can't"!
Then, are we mis evaluating?
Are we thinking every tall WR who is nice and will be a good citizen is who we want instead of a kid who is explosive? Who may have some questionable decisions in their past( but as Christians we steer them the right way we do not keep them away, right ). Kids will make mistakes; will they learn or will they repeat them is the question.
I think scheme may be more of our issue. We have some fast WR's on the squad. Turner and Brown and Williams are fast twitch guys.
But, let's see. I am hoping for the best all the while; I am asking these questions Keep in mind.
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CU Guru [1045]
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Re: I'm Just Waiting On The Creativity Aspect From Garrett ---
Apr 11, 2024, 1:46 PM
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No, our talent is the issue. We simply don't have the same kind of talent at receiver as we did during the last decade. It's not the scheme.
We also aren't turning aways guys for the reasons you mentioned. The better players simply went to other schools. Again, let's hope the new guys change that.
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110%er [7179]
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"Once again", who are referencing from the past?****
Apr 10, 2024, 11:51 PM
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Orange Blooded [4596]
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Re: "Once again", who are referencing from the past?****
Apr 11, 2024, 5:59 AM
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I assumed the "name" was Bowden.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: "Once again", who are referencing from the past?****
Apr 11, 2024, 12:06 PM
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I assumed the "name" was Bowden.
Correct!
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Head Coach [771]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 6:07 AM
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Sonny Dykes learned his trade from...you guessed it...Chad Morris...he is the common thread in many of these great offensive minded coaches...Chad never flourished at Arkansas cause they were tied to Frank Broyles running game till you wilt!
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 11, 2024, 6:58 AM
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I think it is fair to expect a significant jump in offensive production in year two.
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Commissioner [948]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 7:18 AM
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It’s like we forced Shipley last year.
Now we have Mafah for certain. Better OLine.
Full off season with offense, added weapons. Hopefully keep our top wr healthy.
Guys were always open and we moved the ball easily last year, just catastrophic plays/decisions in the red zone.
I expect a big jump in scoring offense year two.
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 6:19 PM
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I agree with those plays being catastrophic but in years past they wouldn’t have been bc the next drive we would score in 4 plays … if you are looking at it from a statistical standpoint year the offense isn’t terrible if we just wanna be average… but a few fumbles at bad times never used to cost us games and it’s bc our offensive is so far from explosive it magnifies these bad plays and turnovers bc our plays and drives seem limited.
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 7:20 AM
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Look at the position coaches Riley has had to work with. You have to be surrounded by a good cast to perform well. You can’t blame Riley for all the offensive woes. Luke won’t be able to fix the oline in his first season either. I give it a couple of years to make up for the lack of development from previous position coaches. I’m not sold on Grisham and Richardson either.
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 11, 2024, 9:01 AM
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We started playing better in the ND game last year because we went back to Zone blocking and ran it more (when Cade did not go rouge), not the scheme Riley bought in. so it will be interesting to see what they do this year.
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Legend [16877]
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When Cade goes rogue
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Apr 11, 2024, 9:50 AM
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With the rouge, then there will be questions asked! Not judging him...style is personal...just a comment. 
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Re: When Cade goes rogue
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Apr 11, 2024, 10:25 AM
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Funny how one letter in the wrong place changes everything! Lol!
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110%er [7179]
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To Be Clear. Not if he is better than Dykes. But, can he be productive w/o him.
Apr 11, 2024, 12:18 PM
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My questions was around "IF" he can be productive without S. Dykes.
Wasn't a knock on G. Riley. Not if you just look at the question without emotion and feelings.
Going off last season! To me it appears he struggled when running his very own offense that was completely his for the 1st time.
Dykes meanwhile lost a ton of players from the National Championship contending team; but still a year later, "finished 10th in offense"!
So, the argument about talent. TCU does not get talent like Clemson does( stop it ).
They had a senior laden team when they played for the title and a year later they were still offensively one of the best in CFB.
Meanwhile, Riley although he had to get used to the players( I give you that ) had more talent "potential" on the roster at Clemson. But, his offense struggled.
Again, I linked his coaching stops and what positions he had at each. Last year was his 1st where "he was the man 100%"! Dykes fingerprint and boot print was on the offensive success at SMU and TCU when Riley was there.
Riley leaves - Dykes offense is still productive. Get it? To the tune of 10th Nationally.
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 12:52 PM
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Dykes has a losing record for his career without Riley as his OC.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 11, 2024, 6:12 PM
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Dykes has a losing record for his career without Riley as his OC.
I will take your word. But, still off topic to be honest. I am only speaking about what G. Riley did w/o Dykes and vice versa "offensively"!
Dykes lost a bunch of what had been 3-star talent to the NFL from one of the most explosive offenses in the country. And, still finished in the top 10 with more "lower rated players than Clemson on offense cumulatively speaking"! Yet, top 10.
Riley - didn't produce a top 10 offense. Is all I am saying.
No way people are suggesting TCU had better skill players by star rating as Clemson last year( post Riley)?
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110%er [6397]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 12, 2024, 9:01 AM
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TCU was 10th in total offense in 2022 with Riley at OC.
TCU was 41st in total offense in 2023 without Riley at OC.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 12, 2024, 8:13 PM
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TCU was 10th in total offense in 2022 with Riley at OC.
TCU was 41st in total offense in 2023 without Riley at OC.
Last year was 2023. Please, check that again sir!
They were 10th last year too then. I.E. their production didn't change after Riley left and all those seniors left.
Please, click link in my original post. LSU was 1st due to all of the Jayden Daniels heroics in the link provided.
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 12, 2024, 9:04 AM
[ in reply to Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes? ] |
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And, yes, TCU had better offensive weapons in 2022 than Clemson had last year.
They had a 1st and 4th round pick at WR
They had a 2nd round pick at OG
They had a 3rd round pick at RB
And they had a senior QB that was a 7th round pick
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 5:00 PM
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I certainly expected more out of Riley last year given the perceived talent level at Clemson versus TCU. Hoping to see a significant improvement this year with last year behind him...
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CU Guru [1813]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 11, 2024, 6:32 PM
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Riley is running the same offense here he ran at TCU. Short passes and a lot of screens. Max Duggan was the difference
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 11, 2024, 7:01 PM
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Riley is running the same offense here he ran at TCU. Short passes and a lot of screens. Max Duggan was the difference
True!
That me to look at that years Dual Threat QB class.
Max Duggan was 4th.
Bo Nix - 1st.
Jayden Daniels - 2nd.
Sam Howell - 3rd.
Clemson fans - Taisun Phommachanh was 5th.
He and Duggan basically graded evenly in the composite. Did we fail Taisun?
Or did we offer the wrong kid(evaluation).
https://247sports.com/Season/2019-Football/CompositeRecruitRankings/?InstitutionGroup=HighSchool&Position=DUAL
Message was edited by: HillRockTiger®
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Orange Blooded [2354]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 11, 2024, 8:06 PM
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Last I recall , Dabo said Rily is running Clemsons offense. Not his.
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CU Guru [1813]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 11, 2024, 8:13 PM
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You’re correct. The Clemson and TCU offenses are very similar based on what I’ve seen
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All-In [44059]
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A very fair question.
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Apr 11, 2024, 8:48 PM
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A follow-up:
Is Riley allowed full control of the offense, or is he being hamstrung by Dabo?
I ask this because our offense last year looked a lot more like our offense the previous year than it did TCU’s offense under Riley.
Dabo also emphasized at one point last year that Riley was brought in to run Clemson’s offense, and that Clemson was not running Riley’s offense.
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Legend [16877]
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And we're off...hoops is done, now time to turn attention
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Apr 12, 2024, 8:51 AM
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To any sliver of negativity that can be mustered. Stripes never change. Never.
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Orange Blooded [4742]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
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Apr 12, 2024, 12:02 PM
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Until we buy, or bring in, an Offensive line........nothing will work and nothing else really matters.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 12, 2024, 8:19 PM
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Until we buy, or bring in, an Offensive line........nothing will work and nothing else really matters.
When Ohio State had Urban and Mr. Sweater(can't think of his name but he was a dang good coach). They kept dominant OL play as a staple.
When Urban was at Florida, Utah and Bowling Green - same thing!
None of the fancy stuff works without good solid OL play! So, I agree with this 100%.
Georgia's last couple years has been centered around that OL. The Georgia TB position has had great talent; but their OL has created some nice running lanes. Which meant eventually having to load the box and then have 4 and 5-star WR's one on one with an accurate QB. Good luck!
Same thing with Bama! Built on the OL.
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Re: Garrett Riley. Is He Avg. W/O Sonny Dykes?
Apr 13, 2024, 4:26 PM
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You have options cooterville always looking for fans.
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Replies: 46
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