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Legend [16930]
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Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:00 PM
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I discovered this nice little sortable index at sports-reference.com: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/conferences/acc/men/coaches.html#coaches::4
Brad Brownell is now tied for the 13th longest tenure by years in ACC basketball history. Of the 13 coaches with equal or longer tenures only 1 has made the NCAA tournament less times over that tenure. That is Bud Millikan at Maryland. Unfortunately for Brad, Millikan coached from 1954-1967 when it was considerably more difficult to make the NCAA tourney. Brad also has the next lowest overall win percentage of those coaches - second worst only to Millikan.
Of those 13 other coaches, only 7 have coached predominantly in the 64 team era that began in 1985. Brad has made the NCAA tourney 3 times. Of the other 7 coaches to have coached as long or longer than Brad in this era, none have made it less than 8 times - Leonard Hamilton at FSU.
25 coaches have coached in the ACC for 10 or more seasons. Of those, Brownell ranks 21st in overall win percentage. Of those 25, 14 have coached predominately in the 64 team era. Amongst those, Brad is tied for last with Cliff Ellis.
Brownell's .577 overall win percentage ranks him 47th of the 94 all-time ACC coaches. Of the 47 coaches below Brad in overall win percentage, only Bud Millikan had a longer tenure. In fact, of those 47, only 5 were given longer than 7 seasons as a head coach. Of those 5 only 1 also coached in the 64 team era - Paul Hewett at Georgia Tech.
I have asserted that the length of time invested in Brad is unprecedented in the 64 team era. Here it is in Black & White (or whatever colors your monitor displays it).
In conclusion: Fire Brad! Brad Sucks!
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All-In [40100]
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I'm so excited about where we are with most of our other
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:04 PM
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programs that I care about. However, I care alot about basketball and have little excitement these days. It is unfortunate.
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All-In [27346]
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Re: I'm so excited about where we are with most of our other
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:06 PM
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agreed
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110%er [5483]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:16 PM
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Send to AD. Fire Brad.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:18 PM
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GOSH A NEGATIVE ARTICLE ABOUT COACH BROWNELL BY COACH VIZCOOT. IN OTHER SHOCKING NEWS, WATER IS WET.
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Legend [18798]
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No matter what your position on the matter....
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:32 PM
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The OP was very informative and not just complaining about CBB.
But like always, you make a douchee comment.
You must be great at parties.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: No matter what your position on the matter....
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:40 PM
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YOU WOULD PROBABLY BE SHOCKED. HEY WE GET IT, VIZCOOT HATES COACH BROWNELL. WHO NEEDS TO READ THE SAME DRIVEL OVER AND OVER THAT HE OBVIOUSLY SPENDS 24/7 RESEARCHING. IT IS LIKE GROUNDHOG DAY OVER AND OVER.
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Legend [18798]
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
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Jul 13, 2023, 2:42 PM
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pretty simple really. if you talk sh!t about clemson, its coaches or its players, i am going to respond. i certainly do not agree with everything every coach does but there are places to complain other than a site all our recruits we know visit. i got email, text chains with friends and other ways to voice my concerns. and have used all of them. every program deserves our support whether you agree with every decision or not.
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Freshman [-100]
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Brownell is horrible.
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Jul 13, 2023, 2:55 PM
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Recruits, if you're reading this, not every fan is as delusional as deroberts. Brownell sucks. Go somewhere else.
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Freshman [-98]
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Midol Man
Jul 13, 2023, 3:38 PM
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You dingleberries wetting your panties about BB in July are obviously brainless due to the vapors. Snort a few Midol and pray it helps.
So, to clarify, hating Clemson sports is NOT what fans do. Fans are fanatical in their support, NOT in their hatred of their program. Maybe you didn’t know where the name originated?
Thanks if you were able to understand. It’s been many years since I was a day drinker, so I can’t relate to randomly researching until I find a reason to be so unhappy on a lovely Summer day. But haters love to dwell on their hatred.
Hate on! But please give to iptay so you can gripe to folks that have influence. Not much worse than wasted hatred, you may need it in case we fumble or something. The readers of Tnet have zero influence, as illustrated by BBs presence as our coach.
Just a small dose of reality…
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Legend [16930]
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Re: Midol Man
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Jul 13, 2023, 5:49 PM
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“Reality” is in the op. Let us know what we’re overlooking in the link I provided that demonstrates Brownell’s prowess.
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Legend [17098]
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Re: Midol Man
Jul 13, 2023, 7:34 PM
[ in reply to Midol Man ] |
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Cry me a river 😢
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Freshman [-100]
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Your mother cries
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Jul 14, 2023, 8:01 AM
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Every nite she goes to bed b/c of the pansie she raised.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
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Jul 13, 2023, 3:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people? ] |
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Kind of renders a message board pointless if we're only allowed to say nice things. Should we all just check in once a day to declare how content we are with everything. Our basketball program is what it is, historically, because of apathy. I want people who care about basketball to know they aren't alone and perhaps should raise their voices too. We are squandering an unprecedented opportunity to grow our basketball program - the visibility of Clemson has never been greater. It also a period of unparalleled economic growth. We can and should be better.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
Jul 13, 2023, 3:15 PM
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COMPLAINING IS FINE AND SHOULD HAPPEN. WHAT YOU DO IS NOT COMPLAINING. IT IS TOXIC AND IT IS CONSTANT 24/7.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
Jul 13, 2023, 3:23 PM
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Unfortunately our AD has sent the message that performance doesn't matter. If an AD is not going to make decisions based on the coach's actual performance he is inviting the fans to force his hands. It is never a good look when a fan base is pushed to that point. I'm far from alone in this.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
Jul 13, 2023, 3:33 PM
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User Logo
viztiz®
All-TigerNet [11561]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
Jul 13, 2023, 3:23 PM
Reply
Unfortunately our AD has sent the message that performance doesn't matter. If an AD is not going to make decisions based on the coach's actual performance he is inviting the fans to force his hands. It is never a good look when a fan base is pushed to that point. I'm far from alone in this.
SO HERE IS A QUESTION. HOW MANY TIMES HAVE YOU EMAILED NEFF WITH THESE CONCERNS OR BETTER YET PICKED UP THE PHONE AND CALLED. NO FAIR LIEING. THINK WE KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS QUESTION. I SUPPOSE YOU MUST THINK NEFF GETS HIS INFO FROM THE I HATE BROWNELL TIGER BOARD. AND WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU GRACED THE DOORS OF LITTLEJOHN. AND AGAIN, NO LIEING.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: But DR why do your posts always have to attack people?
Jul 13, 2023, 5:47 PM
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I have traded multiple emails with Neff over the last year and a couple months. I did not attend any home games last season (I do not live in the upstate) but I attended two the season before and have only missed a couple USC/Clemson basketball games in the last 30 years.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:34 PM
[ in reply to Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected ] |
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so which fact, that I would bet you were unaware of, do you think shouldn't matter or is misleading? I'm his biggest dumper and it is actually worse than I suspected. He is the least successful coach of the 64 team tournament era to coach more than 7 years and we are about to double it up. If Brad makes the tournament 5 consecutive seasons (yeah right) and Leonard Hamilton retires tomorrow - Brad would still be tied for last amongst the coaches with 13 or more seasons as coach in tourney appearances.
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110%er [5483]
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Freshman [-100]
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Fire Brownell
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:19 PM
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And ridicule anyone who supports him.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: Fire Brownell
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Jul 13, 2023, 3:09 PM
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SPEAKING OF BEING FUN AT PARTIES. LMA AT THIS GOOBER.
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Freshman [-100]
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Great response. It really shows your mental capacity
Jul 14, 2023, 7:59 AM
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Is as lacking as we all believe it to be.
What a moron.
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CU Medallion [64593]
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The lunatic fringe (CobbOx) isn't going to like this***
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:23 PM
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null
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Orange Blooded [2849]
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I am not a member of the Lunatic Fringe
Jul 14, 2023, 9:01 AM
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The Fringe exists to bash the Clemson basketball program on a daily basis. It is getting really old. I mean really old.
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CU Medallion [58461]
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Bottom line - somebody needs to fix Clemson basketball.
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:32 PM
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I have believed for some time that we need to move in another direction regarding head basketball coach. Having said that, this isn't all Brownell's fault. Somebody up the ladder has to give a flying #### about Clemson basketball and put an end to this embarrassment. I don't know if it's the BOT or the president or the AD or big donors or the man behind the curtain, somebody has to givadam.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: Bottom line - somebody needs to fix Clemson basketball.
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:36 PM
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it's definitely awful that the only arguably worse coach over a long tenure is Cliff Ellis. I know that Cliff coached in a much more competitive ACC but we have to stop being the program that lets mediocre coaches take up residency.
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CU Medallion [58461]
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Re: Bottom line - somebody needs to fix Clemson basketball.
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:47 PM
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On one level you have UNC/Dook/Gonzagas/Kansas etc. who are perrenial powerhouses and recruit at the highest level and reload year after year. Then there is another level below that made up of teams that have more recently become a factor or are fairly consistently ranked but rarely/never make the final 4. Then there is everybody else, and that's where we are, buried deep in the "everybody else". We should raise the bar just a notch, and expect to be in that next tier, and consistently make the NCAA Tournament and at least crack the top 25 most years. Anything less should be viewed as total failure.
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Re: Bottom line - somebody needs to fix Clemson basketball.
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Jul 13, 2023, 2:01 PM
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I think even teams in the "everybody else" category occasionally have a really good year.
Except us...
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110%er [5084]
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110%er [6982]
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Legend [17645]
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Until ten years ago, I attended a few home games from SAV
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Jul 13, 2023, 9:17 PM
[ in reply to Bottom line - somebody needs to fix Clemson basketball. ] |
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every year. Never missed a game from 1979-1984. All out on Clemson Basketball for 10 years. Consistently bad basketball especially in key games and moments.
BTW. When the MD coach coached in the 50's-60's, only the ACC Tourney winner made the NCAA Tourney. If the #1 team in the country lost in the ACC tourney, their season was over unless invited to NIT.
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All-In [46587]
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Brad is the best mens basketball head coach we have!
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:44 PM
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He’s the best men’s basketball head coach we have, period!🤷🏻♂️
🤣😂
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Hall of Famer [24618]
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But But But Brownell just got a commitment from a blue chip BB Player....***
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Jul 13, 2023, 1:48 PM
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110%er [5483]
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Re: But But But Brownell just got a commitment from a blue chip BB Player....***
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Jul 13, 2023, 2:12 PM
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He will either ruin him or he will transfer.
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Heisman Winner [134836]
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Hopefully this year he can turn it around. If not, it's
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Jul 13, 2023, 2:45 PM
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time to move on.
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CU Guru [1893]
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Re: Hopefully this year he can turn it around. If not, it's
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Jul 13, 2023, 3:05 PM
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It's way past time to move on. Brownell has the longest tenure of any Clemson men's basketball coach, and has not accomplished much. A win in Chapel Hill and one Sweet 16 appearance does not even begin to offset the horrible losses, such as the Morehead St. debacle to end last season. Brownell would have been long gone but for the ridiculous contract D-Rad gave him. Now the administration can't fire him without losing face over the buyout. We all know Brownell will never win the ACC tournament. Except for money, there is absolutely no reason to keep him, if you aspire to more than abject mediocrity. One good recruit isn't going to change anything. Look at PJ Hall. With Hall, Brownell has not even sniffed the tournament championship game.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: Hopefully this year he can turn it around. If not, it's
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Jul 13, 2023, 3:12 PM
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THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL YEARS I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE BEST IF WE WENT IN ANOTHER DIRECTION. LAST YEAR WAS NOT ONE OF THEM. WE HAD A GOOD, ENTERTAINING TEAM THAT GOT SCREWED OUT OF A BID. SIMPLE AS THAT.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: Hopefully this year he can turn it around. If not, it's
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Jul 13, 2023, 3:19 PM
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i've never questioned the authenticity of your fandom. We don't agree about a lot but I have said before that I at least understand your perspective. You're consistent. You have also put in more than a few years watching basketball. The NCAA tournament has had 64 teams for nearly 40 years. So the metrics that determine who gets in are not a mystery. So stop pretending you actually think we earned a bid. You're better than that. We did not deserve a bid and long before they called the names I told anyone who would listen we weren't getting in. We did not have the RPI. We did not have the NET. People got excited about our finish in the ACC - but that didn't matter and history showed it wouldn't matter. You can not lose multiple games to terrible teams and make the NCAA tourney - which is precisely what we did. It is also a recurring pattern in Brownell's tenure that he loses those types of games then outperforms in the ACC schedule and a bunch of folks on here get sucked in thinking we're gonna make it.
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110%er [5483]
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Legend [16930]
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Re: Hopefully this year he can turn it around. If not, it's
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Jul 13, 2023, 3:25 PM
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it should have been enough for an ardent athletic director to change course.
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CU Guru [1893]
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Re: Hopefully this year he can turn it around. If not, it's
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Jul 13, 2023, 4:58 PM
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Unfortunately, until it makes sense from the dollar perspective, nothing is going to change. The administration absolutely does not care about having a top-notch basketball program. And by top-notch, I mean one that makes the NCAA tournament more often than it doesn't. Brownell has long since proven he will never turn Clemson into a top-notch basketball program. What is also disturbing is how many T-netters are willing to settle for mediocrity.
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CU Guru [1893]
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Varsity [231]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
Jul 13, 2023, 4:07 PM
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We just need to give him 30 more years. Then no matter what stat you pick, he'll be #1 among all ACC coaches that have coached at least 43 years
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CU Guru [1893]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
Jul 13, 2023, 4:59 PM
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Except for number of NCAA tournament appearances.
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Orange Blooded [2420]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
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Jul 14, 2023, 1:09 AM
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No fair stating the facts. That is insensitive to Brad.
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Orange Blooded [2849]
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Brad Brownell is the only Clemson coach
Jul 14, 2023, 8:56 AM
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With a career record of .500 in the ACC. This program has no history. He has provided stability and 10 consecutive winning seasons. Time for you to stop beating the drum because you have caved it in. No Clemson basketball coach in history has done a better job with the program. Just check the records. It's not Brownell's fault the Tigers got screwed out of the NCAA Tournament last season. CBB is going to silence and all of the rest of the haters this season.
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Legend [16930]
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Re: Brad Brownell is the only Clemson coach
Jul 14, 2023, 9:25 AM
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Lol. Unfortunately the actual facts refute what you’re saying. Brownell’s ability to be worst in overall win% of coaches tenured over 8 seasons (the worst!) speaks to how dismissed the ACC is that he can simultaneously be over .500 in conference. AND - by SRS he also plays a weaker OOC schedule than most those coaches he is worse than. He’s is demonstrably terrible. Just cause he swings by your cocktail soirée before each game changes nothing.
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Orange Blooded [2669]
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Re: Brownell - It's actually worse than I suspected
Jul 18, 2023, 8:02 AM
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Hard to find this thread as you put it on the football board. MORAN!!!
It's almost like every coaching decision and every program is unique!
How many of these programs that you speak of have never won a conference title/any title that matters?
How many of those programs made the sweet 16 the year their HC was likely to be fired?
How many of those coaches only had 1 losing season in 13 seasons of coaching?
How many of those programs were financed so poorly through the first half of the HC's tenure?
How many of those programs got facility upgrades halfway through the coaches tenure and recruiting started to get much better.
You can cry all you want, but Brownell is still our HC, and it took a unique set of circumstances to get where we are now. Luckily our program is currently as strong as it has every been before.
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