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More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:33 PM
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Hope everyone enjoyed the article this morning on the draft-eligible players and what we have heard about their draft status. That has led, as you can imagine, to a lot of discussion. It also led to more information coming my way from a VERY reliable source.
I was told by a VERY reliable source that in addition to the evals done by the Draft Advisory Committee, Clemson reached out to seven different NFL GM's for their own personal evals. This actually took place before the DAC sent out their recommendations. The evals from the GM's came back and the consensus was rounds 2-3 for the top two guys (Hyatt, Wilkins maybe?) and lower for all the rest.
This appears to be a very need-specific draft. The best available player won't always be chosen. This, in my opinion, is going to be fascinating to watch going forward.
The scout also told me that I need to look at the current Clemson DL in comparison to Vic Beasley and Grady Jarrett. He said none of them match up to the physical style of play of those two, of absolutely dominating the man in front of them. This has been an eye-opener for me, that's for sure.
I hope all of these guys make the right decision because in the long run, the decision could mean millions of dollars one way or the other.
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Orange Blooded [3882]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:38 PM
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The top 2 players (to me) would be Wilkins and Dorian O'Daniel. Hyatt is not going to be drafted in the 2nd round. Thanks for the valuable info David!
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All-TigerNet [14751]
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O'daniel was great but I'm interested in how he translates
Jan 8, 2018, 1:46 PM
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the NFL, he strikes me as a tweener. Perhaps a 4-3 OLB? Nowhere near the size to be a 3-4 OLB and I don't think he can play DB, maybe I'm wrong.
If he is a special team dynamo and package guy on defense that won't warrant a high pick.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: O'daniel was great but I'm interested in how he translates
Jan 8, 2018, 2:44 PM
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He would need to add a lot of weight to be an OLB in a 3-4 scheme. I could see him being a strong safety though, he's a very versatile player with a wide skill set.
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Legend [16213]
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He's not playing S***
Jan 8, 2018, 2:51 PM
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110%er [6692]
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Re: He's not playing S***
Jan 8, 2018, 2:58 PM
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Ok, sure. Way to add to the convo.
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CU Guru [1322]
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He's going to test very similar to Jabrill Peppers***
Jan 8, 2018, 3:01 PM
[ in reply to He's not playing S*** ] |
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110%er [6692]
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Didn't you see? He's not playing S.***
Jan 8, 2018, 3:03 PM
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CU Guru [1322]
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The NFL doesn't care about positions
Jan 8, 2018, 3:54 PM
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they care about skills and traits
Dorian O'Daniel has the skills and traits of a great coverage linebacker or moneybacker. If a smart team gets their hands on him, he'll be a stud.
Keanu Neal, Deion Jones, Deone Bucannon, Jabrill Peppers, Telvin Smith, Mark Barron
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110%er [6692]
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Re: The NFL doesn't care about positions
Jan 8, 2018, 3:55 PM
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I agree with you, I was just mentioning what another expert NFL analyst stated to my theory of that being a possibility.
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Legend [16213]
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CU Guru [1322]
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they're all moneybackers. that's the point***
Jan 8, 2018, 5:28 PM
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Orange Blooded [4981]
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All-Conference [427]
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yes. 2nd round is what I heard today for these 2 and b/c of
Jan 8, 2018, 5:13 PM
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the amount of QB's needed/available really messing with this draft. I still think CW would be a 1st round pick b/c of his ability to play any position on the DL.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 2:41 PM
[ in reply to Re: More info on draft eligible players ] |
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O'Daniel wouldn't be included in the group of players David is talking about as he is a senior and only has the option to go to the draft.
They're looking at only top juniors, and I believe they're referencing Wilkins and Ferrell.
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110%er [7726]
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DOD is likely not included in this discussion
Jan 8, 2018, 2:58 PM
[ in reply to Re: More info on draft eligible players ] |
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since he is a senior and has no choice. These evals were likely only for the potential early leavers.
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CU Guru [1052]
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Letterman [270]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:38 PM
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Are your "VERY reliable source" and "the scout" the same person?
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CU Guru [1476]
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its not worth it unless you’re Top 10-15
Jan 8, 2018, 5:20 PM
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That’s where the good money is.
Stay a year and enjoy the best time of your life at Clemson while improving your stock.
Ferrell could stay 2 more years and get a Masters.
Wilkins could get a Masters.
Bryant/Hyatt would just improve their stock.
Cain could use a year with a QB that can throw dimes.
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All-TigerNet [12332]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:38 PM
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Know it's been said before but - absolutely great reporting David! Nice to have some real insight into this process instead of the typical BS coming out of the ESPN talking heads.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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The VERY reliable source is a scout? Didn't "they" take
Jan 8, 2018, 1:40 PM
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Jarrett in the 5th round because he was a little short & light because of it?
Not saying this person is wrong about CW or others on our DL, but throwing Jarrett out seems to be more a reveal of how wrong the NFL cookie cutter can be?
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Orange Blooded [2496]
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BING!! dsp dead on it. Jarrett was a sleeper pick that has absolutely shined in the NFL
Jan 8, 2018, 5:25 PM
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Not many “experts” outside of the Clemson inner-circle saw him blossoming the way he has.
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All-TigerNet [14751]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:40 PM
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I would of guessed Wilkins and Ferrell.
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All-TigerNet [10427]
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Vic Beasley Physical in College?
Jan 8, 2018, 1:43 PM
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I thought Vic Beasley was more of a finesse guy in college who relied on his speed and moves. He put on about 20 pounds between his final game and the NFL combine in order to improve his draft status. I thought at the time why didn't he do this to play in college? Bottom line is that I don't believe he was that physical until he transformed in the NFL.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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One or more prominent gurus even suggested VB avoided piles.***
Jan 8, 2018, 1:48 PM
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Legend [16213]
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110%er [6692]
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Re: he was #### near unblockable***
Jan 8, 2018, 2:46 PM
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Right, he said more of a finesse guy. He was #### near unblockable because of his speed going up against college tackles.
For the NFL he had to put on more weight to be better in run support and because NFL tackles are just a notch above college ones.
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CU Guru [1167]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:46 PM
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David, has there been any comment from your source regarding potential for improving draft status by coming back (barring any unforeseen circumstances and potential for improvement). If a 2nd round played could expect to improve to 1st round, it may play into returning, etc. Same for those outside the 2nd or 3rd round.
Message was edited by: Tiger68®
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CU Medallion [55837]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 2:16 PM
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Everything in the NFL draft for players is luck and risk. Take the risk out by getting everything they can from college FB reps and experience in their 4 years. Take the if I had stayed, out, and go when college is done. Don't ever leave that thought in the back of your mind that I may have made it if I had stayed my senior year. Play that senior year and take all doubts out and play your best all 4 years. Play your final season of college ball, if you were good enough for a 4th 5th round pick as a junior, that final season could earn you a 2nd or 3 round pick, it surely wouldn't cause you to not get picked. It could make the difference if you are picked at all. I just couldn't leave that 4th year on the table that would most likely give me a better chance, the experience its self wouldn't hurt my chances bc MOST college players improve every year that they have played, that is the reason that most seniors are starters, they became better FB players!!!
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Rock Defender [73]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 7:41 PM
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I don't know, I think that Mitch Hyatt has regressed this year and may have hurt his draft grade this year verses what he would have been given for his play his freshman and sophomore year. I think Wilkins and Ferrell would have had a higher draft grade for the 2016 season than this season. Their stats definitely were more impressive 2016 season. If it was my kid, I would tell him to look at several factors. It's not guaranteed that another year will make you better or increase your draft stock since things like that depends on more than how good you are, college team scheme, nfl teams with top picks need, draft class depth at your position and other things all factor in. Another year comes with a high possibility of an injury that may drop your draft stock. What will be the position depth among eligible draft players this year compared to next year, NFL position needs this year, etc... Either way I wish these young men all the best.
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Hall of Famer [23994]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:47 PM
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Interesting. I thought we would have 2-3 first round guys this year since that's what the experts have been saying all season.
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Legend [16213]
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You can't take what the Clemson Homers say on the radio at
Jan 8, 2018, 1:59 PM
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face value...Anybody who thought all 3 dl were going in the 1st this year were drinking koolaid
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110%er [6692]
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Guess you don't read the mock drafts on the interwebs.***
Jan 8, 2018, 3:05 PM
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Legend [16213]
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Why would I? They are fairy tales invented purely for click
Jan 8, 2018, 5:08 PM
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bait...Congratulations, you're a rube
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 1:48 PM
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I’ve always though Clelin and Bryant were overhyped when there were projections of them going 1st round. Compare them to Vic and Shaq, both of whom went 1st round, and they aren’t as good. Vic and Shaq were more gifted pass rushers. Clelin and Bryant need another year to develop. I would say Christian and Grady are pretty close. Hyatt desperately needs another year.
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All-TigerNet [14751]
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Also Christian's versatility make him that much more
Jan 8, 2018, 1:50 PM
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valuable, I'd be SHOCKED if he wasn't a high pick.
The others, I somewhat see your point although if Ferrell isn't first round then some analysts who had him in the top 10 need to find another line of work.
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CU Medallion [55837]
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Re: Also Christian's versatility make him that much more
Jan 8, 2018, 2:24 PM
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To think that Christian wouldn't become a better player with a 4th year of college FB, then explain why NFL coaches and owners would rather they stayed for their senior year. It's bc they know they become more experienced and even more matured by the time they get them!!!
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All-In [44183]
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Just be careful in having an opinion.
Jan 8, 2018, 2:02 PM
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According to tigerking79, if you have an opinion then you think you own players.
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Legend [17969]
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DHS bringing it! This is why I subscribe along with the annual steak knives gift.***
Jan 8, 2018, 2:08 PM
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Legend [16891]
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So...these Scouts, etc.
Jan 8, 2018, 2:18 PM
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Are they about to pi$$ off a bunch of returning Tigers with a point to prove next year...with extreme prejudice? Have mercy on the opponents...after the games.
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CU Medallion [66713]
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Just hope the "reliable source" wasn't Mel Kiper!
Jan 8, 2018, 2:39 PM
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nm
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All-TigerNet [13062]
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If Wilkins doesn't go 1st round alot of people have been wrong for a long time now.***
Jan 8, 2018, 2:51 PM
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110%er [7726]
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Sounds like coaches trying to keep their seniors....
Jan 8, 2018, 2:55 PM
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Wilkins is almost a lock to go in the 1st. DOD, Ferrell, Bryant and Cain are all potential 1st rounders if they test really well. If they test decent, they are likely round 2-3 guys. I'd say the floor would be round 5 for these 4, barring an injury or an absolutely crappy combine.
Hyatt is a tough one. He will grade out well through his 3 years, but he is not a physical freak like your typical stud LT. Another year would benefit him a lot from a strength standpoint. But I see him as a round 2-3 guy and destined for RT regardless of if he comes back.
Ray Ray, Joseph, Hearn, and Smith all need to absolutely crush the combine/pro day. Ray Ray is still the only one of the 4 that could sneak into the top 3 rounds.... but that is a looong shot. Likely that most of this 4 goes on the last day or undrafted.
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110%er [5093]
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Re: Sounds like coaches trying to keep their seniors....
Jan 8, 2018, 5:08 PM
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It just doesn’t seem possible that Wilkins wouldn’t go in the first round.
He’s one of the best DL I’ve ever seen play.
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110%er [7726]
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First time I’ve ever agreed with you
Jan 8, 2018, 6:42 PM
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The guy is clearly the best DT in the country. Heck, he was one of the best DE’s in the country last year at 300lbs. He will go in the first.
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All-TigerNet [13062]
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I think "clearly the best DT" is a stretch.
Jan 9, 2018, 2:23 PM
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Da'Ron Payne, Vita Vea, Ed Oliver (even though he's just a SO and not draft eligible), etc. I think all of those guys are in the same league.
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All-TigerNet [13310]
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I just get excited about the possibility of ALL D Lineman
Jan 8, 2018, 3:12 PM
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returning!
Good lord! Wouldn't that be the nastiest group ever assembled???
Plus, add a Richard Yeargin, XT, & KJ Henry and some growth & depth to the D Tackle spot. My word. Nobody would score on them. Nobody.
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1st Rounder [603]
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They are dropping bc of teams' specific position needs
Jan 8, 2018, 5:00 PM
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And not their lack of skills. They could come back and develop more, but their rise to the 1st round/high 2nd could just be a factor of the amount of position players in the draft and team needs of those position players. How QBs are there and teams that need them?
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All-Pro [697]
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Re: They are dropping bc of teams' specific position needs
Jan 8, 2018, 5:16 PM
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^^^This. We could very easily see 5 QB's taken in the first round, which would shorten the slots for other players.
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Orange Blooded [3405]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 5:43 PM
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Am I crazy or did Ray Ray say like a week or so ago that he was going to return? I could have sworn that I read that. What's with the change of mind?
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Orange Blooded [2002]
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Re: More info on draft eligible players
Jan 8, 2018, 6:23 PM
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He did. Obviously something made him change his mind.
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