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Orange Blooded [3965]
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Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 8:25 AM
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the ACCT because they spent more money on their program this year. It’s not possible to win it with the amount of money we spent.
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Orange Blooded [3141]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 8:29 AM
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They need to spend a bit more. Mr. Wuf is looking like a coyote. No wonder Mrs. Wuf won't be seen in public with him these days.
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Legend [17295]
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If only Clemson had followed the Long Beach State strategy.***
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Mar 17, 2024, 8:54 AM
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All-TigerNet [13891]
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They only won because Virginia gave them the game,
Mar 17, 2024, 8:54 AM
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Tobacco Road officiating, they had the advantage of playing meaningful games, they got the chance to play five straight games…just rattling off what the Brad cultists will say.
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All-In [44054]
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NC State spends about $2 million more per year on their basketball program.
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:04 AM
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That’s about 25% more than we spend ($10 million vs. $8 million).
But I’m sure you don’t care, since it’s not football.
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All-TigerNet [13891]
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Judge Clueless the troll chimes in again***
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:07 AM
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All-TigerNet [13891]
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Legend [16263]
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Clemson's football budget is barely Top 25 in the country.
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:28 AM
[ in reply to NC State spends about $2 million more per year on their basketball program. ] |
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Our worst finish the past 12 years was last year's 20th final ranking, and of course the natties, Top 5's, and Top 15's to boot in that span.
Clear evidence right here at home of the difference between great coaching talent and marginal coaching talent, and the results you can achieve with either.
Go Tigers!
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110%er [5396]
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Re: Clemson's football budget is barely Top 25 in the country.
Mar 17, 2024, 10:32 AM
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I am curious. Do we know where Clemson ranks on basketball spending compared to other schools? I honestly don’t but, would hope it would be a similar ranking to football.
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Legend [16263]
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Re: Clemson's football budget is barely Top 25 in the country.
Mar 17, 2024, 11:05 AM
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Our basketball program budget is around 40th in the country from what I've seen reported prior.
The prior five years to this season we've finished out with a ~ 75 NET / RPI ranking. We are sitting at 35th right now on this one.
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All-In [44054]
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All-In [28416]
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we should take the thiefs salary and reinvest in program BRAD SUX***
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:22 PM
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Oculus Spirit [80431]
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110%er [6099]
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Legend [16921]
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Re: NC State spends about $2 million more per year on their basketball program.
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:46 AM
[ in reply to NC State spends about $2 million more per year on their basketball program. ] |
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Ah, this old trope. Throw out a number from a random site and just accept it at face value. Athletic expense reporting, such as made pursuant to the Knight Commission, is non-standardized. So it is effectively meaningless for comparative purposes. But, even if it was, it also does not control for cost differences incurred by different schools. NC State is in an urban center and leases their coliseum use. How much, alone, does renting their facility for basketball (where they also lease office space) contribute to this disparity? The only way to know would be a genuine operating budget analysis - which NC State does not appear to make readily available. Their primary annual fiscal reports only show “athletics” as a single line item. Clemson’s contains detailed revenue and expenses for football and basketball. So just throwing out a number and making a jab at football does not prove your point.
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All-TigerNet [10640]
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Re: NC State spends about $2 million more per year on their basketball program.
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:56 AM
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There you go giving out facts again!
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Orange Blooded [2000]
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Oculus Spirit [80431]
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Orange Blooded [4036]
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Why can JK not understand that cost of living / wages are higher in Raleigh.
Mar 17, 2024, 2:16 PM
[ in reply to NC State spends about $2 million more per year on their basketball program. ] |
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When you total up costs - it is not as simple as just dollars.
It is also cost of living. Rent, travel, wages for support staff, etc etc.
He bangs the stupid drum and does not understand economics and accounting.
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All-TigerNet [10476]
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Raleigh is a pretty urban area.***
Mar 17, 2024, 9:25 AM
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110%er [8589]
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Since NIL payments aren't public we don't know how much they spent
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:26 AM
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Their leading scorer on the season (who had 29 points last night) DJ Horne transferred in this season. I'm sure he didn't "come home" for free.
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110%er [6099]
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State seems to be "all in" on the collectives/NIL. Their football and basketball
Mar 17, 2024, 9:33 AM
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is likely to improve under this "new system."
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Legend [16263]
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110%er [8589]
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How much is that total?
Mar 17, 2024, 10:23 AM
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We don't know that's the point. Reliable reports are that Villanova spent $3M in NIL this season do we believe Clemson is anywhere close to that? We really don't have any idea what NCSU, Clemson, Duke...anyone spends so trying to argue about the differences is pointless.
BTW though, that mercenary guard NCSU brought in scored 27 against us in our loss including 7 of their last 10 points. So, I guess it was money well spent.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: How much is that total?
Mar 17, 2024, 1:18 PM
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On3 had PJ Hall as the highest paid NIlL athlete at Clemson at one point. I have no idea their methodology but, assuming they had one and weren’t blindly making it up, wouldn’t it likely be relative? Meaning, even if they were off in absolute dollars shouldn’t the highest paid be the highest paid?
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110%er [8589]
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Your assumption is wrong; On3s estimates are garbage
Mar 18, 2024, 9:43 PM
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They just simply take the count of social media followers a player has and multiply it by a factor to estimate his/her NIL potential; they have absolutely no insight on any actual NIL payments. They explain their”methodology” on their website if you care to look at it. I have no doubt PJ has a healthy NIL income, but how it compares to anyone else’s no one can tell you because it’s not public information.
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Orange Blooded [3223]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:31 AM
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I guess you need a lesson in sports economics. Clemson won one championship in 1981. How did Dabo win two? He’s spent the money. He built the best football facilities on the planet. He forced every team to build a bigger better Dabo land football complex to stay relevant. Meanwhile, Dabo was pulling in better recruits and able to hire better coaches. Dollars in equals wins out the door. Look at at the winningest schools in basketball history, they spend the most. There is a direct correlation between dollars spent and wins. You should probably have taken statistics. Here’s some data to support my theory.
https://www.three-man-weave.com/3mw/college-basketball-budgets-2020
Please note that schools that spend outside the top 25, have NEVER won anything. Maybe a mid major conference championship and a one and some NCAAT. It’s simple. Build it, and they will come.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 9:55 AM
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It’s also a chicken or the egg argument. Schools that win at the highest level invest to stay there because they realize the returns on the investment. Clemson was not in the top 25 in total spending when Dabo made his first playoff. Per one source our expenses increased 130% from $24.19 mill to $55.65 mill from 2014-2018. Being at the top of the expenses pile is as much as a consequence of success as determinant. Correlation =/= causation.
Message was edited by: viztiz®
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All-TigerNet [10640]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 10:07 AM
[ in reply to Re: Clearly NCST only won ] |
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Have you recently looked at St. Peter's budget .......... 1.6 million when they advanced as far or further than we ever have in the NCAA tournament.
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All-In [44054]
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People here seem to have a memory block when it comes to football.
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Mar 17, 2024, 12:52 PM
[ in reply to Re: Clearly NCST only won ] |
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Dabo didn't start winning big until we upped our investment in football to commit to higher assistant coach salaries, new facilities, etc.
People here like to imagine that Dabo bootstrapped it on a minimal budget and “proved” himself before the bean counters gave him more money. It makes for a great rags to riches story for “little ‘ol Clemson,” a story that will surely be passed down from grandpappy to future generations. But it isn’t true.
Plus, all this happened at a football school with a tradition of high level success, something our basketball program doesn’t have.
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Legend [16921]
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Demonstrably false.
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:10 PM
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Our total football budget surged 160% from 2014-2018. The money followed the success. It was the second largest increase in all of college football by percentage and largest overall in total dollars. We were not a Top 25 program in football expenses in 2014 or 2015.
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All-In [27344]
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Re: Demonstrably false.
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:20 PM
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I seem to recall Dabo forgoing a large annual raise to boost salary for quality assistants. So that would be on him NOT the bean counters
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Legend [16921]
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Re: Demonstrably false.
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:22 PM
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I used to point this out before JK cowardly hid half of the board from his view. He claimed that Dabo’s salary made that a less magnanimous gesture. I wonder how he feels about Tony Bennett doing the same after winning a national championship. Then he donated $1 mill to the school. And he presently makes a lower base salary than Brownell.
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All-In [44054]
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Yes, he did, with the agreement that he would get a nice raise later
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Mar 18, 2024, 10:29 PM
[ in reply to Re: Demonstrably false. ] |
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that would more than make up for his “sacrifice.”
And he did.
Looks like you fell for that slick marketing hook, line, and sinker.
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CU Guru [1045]
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Re: People here seem to have a memory block when it comes to football.
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:13 PM
[ in reply to People here seem to have a memory block when it comes to football. ] |
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Some people also forget that the football complex wasn't built until 2017, which was after the National Championship, the ACC championship, and the Orange Bowl.
Some people also forget that Dabo took a reduced salary to afford the higher priced assistants.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: People here seem to have a memory block when it comes to football.
Mar 17, 2024, 1:20 PM
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Judge Keller has recovered the strength to go back to full troll mode. Referencing dubious sources and mixing them with outright lies like the one you’re responding to.
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Legend [16263]
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This is an absolute falsehood and intentional lie from the troll JK.
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:55 PM
[ in reply to People here seem to have a memory block when it comes to football. ] |
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No matter how many times she has been corrected on that timeline she ignores it and rinses and repeats with this same false drivel. She knows she is lying about this but continues it anyway.
Why would a Brown L pumping troll have to resort to outright lies on repeat like this? Clever sarcastic trolling is one thing - outright lying about past events is another.
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Legend [16263]
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Dabo and Brad each made the same $900,000 salary in their first year.
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Mar 17, 2024, 2:04 PM
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Dabo quickly went to work building up a winning foundation and year by year bumped our stock. Brad took his predecessor's roster to what would be a 4th consecutive NCAA tournament appearance then Shyatt the bed for the next 8 seasons before getting another team back there.
One took contract extensions and raises and improved on those results the following years for everyone involved.
The other took contract extensions and raises and sank back to the sad prior norm fat and happy with his own financial improvement.
One is a hall of famer in the making. The other owns the record for most program losses.
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Commissioner [986]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
Mar 17, 2024, 10:08 AM
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Nc State has a better coach than Clemson
Plus they care about their program reality BB should have been fired a long time ago.
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Walk-On [108]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 10:22 AM
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Then why is NC State’s RPI 69 and Clemson’s is 35, which is currently 3rd in the conference.
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Legend [16263]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
Mar 17, 2024, 10:31 AM
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Yeah - makes you wonder how a coach with a much better roster and ranking could lose, at home, head-to-head, against such an inferior product.
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Walk-On [108]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 11:19 AM
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Just like the #3 ranked team in the country did when Clemson beat UNC at home…. It happens.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
Mar 17, 2024, 1:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: Clearly NCST only won ] |
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The Bros even bragged on how we got the best of the Middlebrooks swap.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
Mar 17, 2024, 1:11 PM
[ in reply to Re: Clearly NCST only won ] |
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If you need it explained you don’t follow sports therefore don’t actually want an explanation. It’s a catch-22.
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All-American [595]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
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Mar 17, 2024, 1:04 PM
[ in reply to Re: Clearly NCST only won ] |
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And how many times did we beat them in the last 5 match ups?
That would be 4. Would have been all 5 if Brownell had stayed home.
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Legend [16921]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
Mar 17, 2024, 1:15 PM
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Are you able to add up all those regular season victories in your mind an enjoy some kind of emotional euphoria? How do you think it would compare to winning an ACC Title? It’s a stupid comparison. NC State fans and players were bawling after that game. When’s the last time a tear was shed over a Clemson basketball game? Maybe the first win at Chapel Hill? That’s all I’ve got.
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All-American [595]
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Re: Clearly NCST only won
Mar 18, 2024, 10:16 PM
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I don't add them up but there is a little euphoria after any win. I hate losing, but I'm able to let it go and look forward to the next one.
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