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110%er [7535]
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Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
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Sep 30, 2023, 11:50 PM
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This is getting out of hand. Players get free trip all expenses paid for him and his family or coaches to visit school for an opportunity to play football and get a better education. An education and school where a very high percentage of players would not even get accepted to said school based on academics.
This is not what college sports are supposed to be about. There needs to be changes made somewhere whether its a Junior Pro league or whatever but paid to visit schools is just ridiculous. Plus players in HS are being paid by colleges just to consider them in recruiting. Absurd!
I will have all my wknds free in the near future minus 1 or 2 likely.
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Athletic Dir [861]
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Why do you hate free markets?
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Sep 30, 2023, 11:58 PM
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It's capitalism - embrace it.
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All-Conference [415]
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I don't hate free markets
Oct 1, 2023, 12:00 AM
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See my comments below/above. If it is capitalism I am for it, but there MUST be something in it for the university. Our name can't be used for sole benefit of coaches, admin salaries, player "salaries" (scholarship/NIL/direct_payment etc) and non-revenue scholarships.
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Legend [19950]
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Re: I don't hate free markets
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Oct 1, 2023, 7:38 AM
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There is something in it for the university: they get a shot at recruiting a blue-chip player. Recruiting blue-chip players wins football games. Winning football games makes a lot of money for the schools and their athletic departments. The athletic department's money mostly comes from media rights deals and private donations, not from the state.
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Orange Blooded [2053]
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That's not how capitalism works, if there is demand
Oct 1, 2023, 10:53 AM
[ in reply to I don't hate free markets ] |
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for blue chip players (from the universities) then they can pay market value.
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110%er [7535]
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Re: Why do you hate free markets?
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Oct 1, 2023, 12:08 AM
[ in reply to Why do you hate free markets? ] |
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State owned schools are not capital businesses for paying athletes to attend. If you want a private school (uhm business) to pay players and give education then go for it. This is not the school program nor sport that my alum status will support or favor. That is a minor pro league you want obviously. I would rather become an App St, Coastal, ECU or similar before we pay players just to visit the program. It's a school not a pay to play system, period.
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Orange Blooded [3227]
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Re: Why do you hate free markets?
Oct 1, 2023, 4:19 AM
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I am not for paying the players at all, but the school is a business.
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Orange Blooded [2053]
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Re: Why do you hate free markets?
Oct 1, 2023, 11:45 AM
[ in reply to Re: Why do you hate free markets? ] |
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> It's a school not a pay to play system, period.
cool, then stop making money off the players.
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CU Guru [1045]
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110%er [7535]
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Re: Why do you hate free markets?
Oct 1, 2023, 12:27 AM
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And players! There will be tons of college athletes getting into tax evasion cases in the very near future. Taking away the non-profit tax exempt institutions will mean that big donors will need to 1099 the players to protect themselves which makes players in a very high tax bracket because they have zero expenses.
Will be a chit-show in near future for players.
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110%er [6899]
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Hope so. They need to see how life really works***
Oct 1, 2023, 10:49 AM
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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The NFL is capitalism at its best and they have rules
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Oct 1, 2023, 1:14 AM
[ in reply to Why do you hate free markets? ] |
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that ALL of the teams must adhere to financially and contractually to MAXIMIZE their respective product (the NFL) to the widest market possible, i.e., they wouldn’t just load 1 team with the best of the best players, leaving the other teams with players that would NEVER beat the “loaded team”.
Their product (the NFL) would become unappealing to its audience if only 1 team ALWAYS won the championship. The NFL would lose viewership and fan interest would wane. Their “product” would become a victim of the capitalist system.
Contrast this to college football, where there are effectively NO RULES for financial and contractual conditions, with hundreds of loopholes to rig the system.
I’d personally love for the universities to collectively FORCE ALL PLAYERS into the transfer portal at the end of EACH SEASON. Then, before the season starts, the universities have a “fantasy football” draft to build their rosters each year.
The FANS would NEVER become loyal to any one player beyond the single season. Players take their NIL contracts with them from team to team. Oh, you are worried about their education? Hey, its the capitalist system at its best. If your players can squeeze in some classes, good for them.
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110%er [7535]
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Re: The NFL is capitalism at its best and they have rules
Oct 1, 2023, 4:43 AM
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What? You cant be serious! So every player has a price tag and buy them at end of season for those that dont hit draft? Then how do you price HS kids?
This makes absolutely no sense to me. How do you build relatioships, how do you make players do workouts, how do players learn a new system every year, how do they get a degree when not every school offers same degrees, etc, etc. This is the dumbest thing I have heard and totally does away with student requirements.
Go watch XFL if thatvis what you wantvas they only get 1yr contracts.
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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The system is only a baby step away from what I describe
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Oct 1, 2023, 7:32 AM
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Look at the chaos that has been IMPOSED on the previous college system, and look at what it has produced…pure garbage across the board.
If making it all about money is what the originators of the NIL suit intended, then “go all in”…MAKE IT ABOUT MONEY.
I’d prefer Clemson exit this scene becoming part of a TRUE COLLEGE LEAGUE that is not the pay-for-play NFL minor-league system, competing across the board with a 2* and 3* roster of STUDENT ATHLETES.
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CU Guru [1867]
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Re: The NFL is capitalism at its best and they have rules
Oct 1, 2023, 5:25 PM
[ in reply to Re: The NFL is capitalism at its best and they have rules ] |
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They should just go ahead and start a minor league system akin to baseball. Those that want to be paid, and simply want a route to the nfl, have at it.
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Legend [19950]
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Revenue sharing and salary caps = capitalism?
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Oct 1, 2023, 7:39 AM
[ in reply to The NFL is capitalism at its best and they have rules ] |
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I guess you are eager for the players to unionize as well? Some of the regulations you seem to be wanting aren't legally possible without collective bargaining.
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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The market is FREE to create other paying leagues - XFL
Oct 1, 2023, 7:47 AM
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That’s capitalism!
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CU Guru [1025]
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All-TigerNet [12214]
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Re: Why do you hate free markets?
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Oct 1, 2023, 9:28 AM
[ in reply to Why do you hate free markets? ] |
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Then why not just get rid of salary caps in the nfl. Those of you saying “free market” clearly do not understand how sports leagues work.
Without guidelines your product will suffer and eventually be a shell of itself.
Your “sports free market” is going to shut down a ton of football programs across the country. Those programs provided a free education to a lot of kids who needed it.
I agree with OP. Amateur sports leagues cannot operate under a “free market” system
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Orange Blooded [4036]
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Re: Why do you hate free markets?
Oct 1, 2023, 11:52 AM
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This assumes the team is the product. It is not. The competition between teams is the product, and the market demands the quality of that competition be maximized, not the individual team's results. In this context, the salary cap makes sense in a free-market. The NFL is maximizing the value of its product - which is the competition between teams.
Because college football currently has no central ownership or control, it is the wild west. You are going to start seeing a lot more Sam Hartwells deferring the draft to play for more money and exposure at the college level.
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CU Guru [1867]
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Legend [18792]
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They only like free markets when it benefits who they want..
Oct 1, 2023, 11:50 AM
[ in reply to Why do you hate free markets? ] |
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..it to. It's quite obvious.
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All-Conference [415]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
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Sep 30, 2023, 11:58 PM
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A link would be welcome.
It will take about a decade, but slowly fans will stop to support "Clemson Tigers" in name but in fact a NFL Dev League operating for benefits of
1) highly paid coaches
1a) well paid ADs and other Admins
2) well paid players
3) scholarships for non revenue sports
4) Nothing itself for Clemson *University* or for its average, non player student.
Is this what we want? In pro-league, NFL, 1/2 of revenue comes to the owner, let us say even 1/4 to 1/6 is his/her profit. I don't want to give away name of "Clemson Tigers" for nothing to 1)-3) above, something has to in it for the university besides 6-7 weekends of tailgating and weekly entertainment in fall. It seems there should be something for the campus/university/students/nerds etc.
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110%er [7535]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 12:02 AM
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Quoted by commentators on the Bama vs Miss St game during halftime few minutes ago. I'm sure you can find a link as it was supposedly during a pre-game interview. No linky.
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All-In [26024]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
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Oct 1, 2023, 12:34 AM
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Let's not forget they are getting a free education, free meals which are better than regular students, free tutors if needed, and free medical care when needed.
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All-TigerNet [10919]
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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I cant see the federal government intervening in NIL
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Oct 1, 2023, 1:21 AM
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regulation.
College football as we knew is already DEAD.
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All-Pro [686]
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Re: I cant see the federal government intervening in NIL
Oct 1, 2023, 7:39 AM
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regulation.
College football as we knew is already DEAD.
Correct. When people, companies, industries, etc. go off the rails we have ( and need) government regulation. Otherwise, we'd still have eleven year olds working in factories like my grandparents did in 1913.
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Orange Blooded [2248]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 6:14 AM
[ in reply to Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit? ] |
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It boils down to enforcement, which the NCAA simply will not do. Unless I am mistaken there are already rules against the schools involvement in NIL and in paying the athletes until they are out of high school. It doesn't matter what rules that you put in place if you are not going to enforce them.
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Trainer [30]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
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Oct 1, 2023, 8:07 AM
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I say this is what separates Coach Swinney from everybody else. Never waste your time with a player who asks for money to visit. He will be the first to quit when the going gets tough. He will be the first to leave for a better offer. I would much rather recruit kids of character no matter what. Coach Swinney gets it! Some of you do not!
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110%er [7535]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
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Oct 1, 2023, 8:36 AM
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100%! There will be zero loyalty to programs if they pay players $$#### just to visit for possible offer. If kid is that greedy and coukd care less about a quality education then I don't want us to invest into them.
If some schools are willing to pay for friends then there definitely needs to be 2 different leagues. I hope Clemson would land in the Traditional league. Plus, I bet the traditional league would be wildly more popular! Just ask XFL if that is what you want.
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Legend [19950]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
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Oct 1, 2023, 8:41 AM
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We should also probably stop paying the coaches so much, since they might just be in it for the money. Our offensive coordinator demonstrated his greed and lack of loyalty when he left TCU for a better-paying job at Clemson. We don't need any of that here. Just pay the head coach an average Clemson professor's salary and the assistants can make a bit less than that. Then we'll know we only have people on our coaching staff who really love Clemson. After all, this isn't professional football. Dabo can go to the NFL or some other pro league if he wants to make the big bucks.
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Letterman [278]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 9:24 AM
[ in reply to Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit? ] |
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I was going to bring up Gene Smith. Its sad reading that article and realizing how far
college football has fallen. I guess its progress. To me, paying players is better than what we have now. Very few players are making money due to their NIL value. They are making money do to their athletic value.
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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New true college league with 2 star and 3 star players
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Oct 1, 2023, 1:16 AM
[ in reply to Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit? ] |
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Make this league fit the original mission of amateur athletics.
Clemson could be in this new league.
I would be just as happy watching the Tigers in this sort of league.
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Orange Blooded [2861]
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Re: New true college league with 2 star and 3 star players
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Oct 1, 2023, 9:45 AM
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I would agree. Give me this all day long vs the other option.
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Starter [377]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 1:20 AM
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Actually...nah...he didnt say it...he actually said that if thats true he has no knowledge of it...the Ohio State AD said it in an interview and the press asked saban if he had heard of it and he said he hadnt but it woukd t surprise him in today's environment!!!
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110%er [7535]
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110%er [7535]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 2:05 AM
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My stance still stands!
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CU Guru [1537]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 6:07 AM
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Tennessee was already doing this so I’m sure they have no problems
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Orange Blooded [4304]
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FAKE NEWS POST: Saban literally said the opposite
Oct 1, 2023, 7:47 AM
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he said he's never heard about Alabama paying anyone to come visit
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110%er [7535]
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Re: FAKE NEWS POST: Saban literally said the opposite
Oct 1, 2023, 4:26 PM
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See my link just above a few posts.
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Legend [19950]
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No one is being forced to pay for visits
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Oct 1, 2023, 8:28 AM
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but there's a reason why some programs are willing to pay $5k for a visit from a top recruit: $5k is basically nothing compared to the projected value of having that player on their team.
Fun fact: the amount of money that Dabo makes in one day would be enough to pay for six $5k visits and still have about $1500 left over.
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Athletic Dir [884]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 9:32 AM
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Everybody understands that NIL money is not supposed to come directly from the schools, right?
Reps of the schools aren't supposed to broker NIL deals. Heck even official boosters aren't supposed to provide NIL money. Good luck enforcing that NCAA.
But my point is tax dollars for public schools are not used for NIL money. Technically, I don't think there is anything stopping state legislatures from setting up NIL collectives but I haven't read all the NIL bills that have been passed. I could see a few rabid states being OK with that, Texas-Ambabambla.
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Starter [377]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 12:00 PM
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I would like to give an analogy about paying pmayers, NIL etc...
What if any of us has a 17 year old daughter who was a 3% percenter in singing...in otjer words she was in the top 3% of the world at her craft of singing...and she signs with a rwcird label and they get the rights to her songs and her performances...would any of us allow her to make the record company millions upon millions or even billions on her songs and perfomances etc...and the record company said okay your part of the compensation for your talent, skills, work is we are going to pay for your college education and all things that go along with that!!!
Woukd we ever take that deal or encourage our own kids to take that deal??? I think not...college football is no different imho!!!
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110%er [7535]
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Re: Saban said that 4-5* players want $5k for official visit?
Oct 1, 2023, 4:39 PM
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That is becoming a professional artist. 98% of the college football players will never land an NFL contract even if they are rated a 4* or whatever. These recruits are being provided top paid training, coaching, plus provided every single thing they need to live a better than a high percentage of Americans and given all the tools to earn a degree costing hundred thousand plus to give them future earning opportunities that they wouldn't normally qualify for under their own academic achievements. They are not professionals as they are supposed to be student athletes hence the need for a Junior Pro League for those that want to get paid on their professional value. Let those players skip college and become part of the working population of America paying taxes. If they want the college experience and earn a degree, then become a student athlete. Let them earn money on signatures, jersey sales, to supplement their experience but not given money just to show up to a school.
I'm all for people earning money but skip the university track if that is your choice.
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