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Thanks Pubs!
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Thanks Pubs!


Feb 15, 2019, 9:46 PM

Now that McConnell is backing the idea of Trump using emergency powers to bypass Congress and act like a tyrant, the next Dem prez will be emergency enacting all sorts of socialist programs.

Obamacare was "rammed down Congress's throat," but at least they could have voted no. Obamacare part 2 will be passed after President Booker declares a national healthcare emergency, and he won't need a single congressional vote.

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LOL!


Feb 15, 2019, 9:54 PM

What a fantasy!

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Re: LOL!


Feb 16, 2019, 10:27 AM

You're probably focusing on my Booker prediction, and not on the precedent being set that will be misused by a Democratic president in the future. Pubs supporting Trump's move here will have no basis for complaining when that happens.

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Re: LOL!


Feb 16, 2019, 11:51 AM

This isn’t precedent. And healthcare will never be classified as a threat to national security, like an open border will. Not to mention aquiring a $Trillion dollars to fund a healthcare system. Where does that money come from?

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Re: LOL!


Feb 17, 2019, 11:13 AM [ in reply to Re: LOL! ]

Theres no new precedent being set. The President is the Commander in Chief of the Military and has full control over the military budget, its one of the Constitutional duties of the President to control the military and its budget. Its also a Constitutional duty of the President and the Military to protect US territory.

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Hahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!


Feb 15, 2019, 10:16 PM

No, Trump continuing an Obama "pen and a phone" precedent down a slippery slope is right.

The Pres. Booker stuff though, pure gold.

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Slippery slope until you tak into account..


Feb 15, 2019, 10:20 PM

all the other nation emergencies still in effect.


hur?

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Look man, you're just plain ignorant


Feb 15, 2019, 10:22 PM

if you don't wake up in a cold sweat nightly, worried about terrorists in the Balkans.

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And the slope is leading downwards with Trump.


Feb 16, 2019, 10:29 AM [ in reply to Hahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!! ]

With Obama people complained because "Obamacare was shoved down our throats!" Except Obama didn't bypass Congress and call a bullshit national emergency. The law was actually passed in Congress.

Pubs who can complain about that and not what Trump is doing clearly have no principles, and will be ignored when they pretend one day to have principles again.

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Thats sort of what slopes do, in fact, that’s the


Feb 16, 2019, 11:37 AM

Entire point of that analogy. “A slippery slope argument, in logic, critical thinking, political rhetoric, and caselaw, is a consequentialist logical device in which a party asserts that a relatively small first step leads to a chain of related events culminating in some significant effect.”

That’s like me saying “you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink”, and you reply, “and that horse is going to ultimately do what it wants to do too!”

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One other thing......


Feb 16, 2019, 12:58 PM

you sorta cherrypicked Obamacare there as your "but Obama" example, I'm assuming because he got Congress to pass it.

He went around Congress on multiple items that didn't pass in congress.....DACA, federal minimum wage, Student loan rates...

So maybe my slippery slope analogy was actually wrong. Let's call it a slippery plateau.

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eggzackly***


Feb 16, 2019, 1:00 PM



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If she's a hollerer, she'll be a screamer.
If she's a screamer, she'll get you arrested.


Those are executive orders and not national emergencies


Feb 16, 2019, 6:01 PM [ in reply to One other thing...... ]

Executive orders don't create new laws or create additional funding. Trump has already created an executive order about his border wall, but Congress controlled the funding for it which is why he has now progressed to declaring a national emergency. If Obama did this, then I see the point you're making by bringing his actions up but I haven't found that evidence yet.

Executive orders have always been a power given to Presidents (Obama didn't invent them, btw) and the same goes for the instituting of national emergencies but what makes this different is that both sides basically agree there isn't really an emergency (even Trump said he "didn't need" to call for an emergency) and Trump is only doing it for political reasons.

If it works, it'll be an interesting precedent to watch unfold in the future.

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Stay macro....you’re going too micro...


Feb 16, 2019, 7:30 PM

No one has claimed that Obama invented executive orders, but what he did do in every example I cited was implement an executive order for something that had already been voted down by Congress (or been refused to be voted on)....in effect he did the same thing as Trump with this emergency——run an end-around on Congress.

Executive orders don’t make laws, but I have no clue where you’re going with this funding line of logic. You’re claiming there was zero additional budget required in a minimum pay raise, and zero costs incurred from artificially limiting student loan payments to 10% of income? That’s silly, of course they did, and they just pulled the budget from elsewhere, much like Trump is doing with the wall funding..,,it’s coming from existing funding sources and is being moved around like the world’s biggest shell game.

If you’re under the impression that I’m a fan of this Trump action, you’re barking up the wrong tree, but it’s partisan hair-splitting at its finest to pretend that fundamentally Obama did anything different with numerous executive orders than Trump did with this emergency act. These are all chump moves based on constitutional technicalities, and Trump learned from, and was emboldened by his predecessor, the very best.

Slippery slopes come home to roost like mixed metaphors.

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details are important (or "micro" is important)...


Feb 16, 2019, 9:01 PM

The point with the funding line of logic is that Trump is asking for additional funds above what he is responsible for, and the only way he could get that is by declaring a national emergency. That's the difference in what he is doing and what Obama and many other presidents have done.

Ask yourself, if executive orders (like Obama did) is the precedent here, why order the national emergency? Something has to be different about doing it that way than simply ordering an executive order (which Trump has already done, as I mentioned).

Yes, in the macro Trump is doing the same thing Obama and many other Presidents have done, but the way he's doing it is a new precedent.

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maybe I’m missing something....


Feb 16, 2019, 9:21 PM

Portions are coming from a drug enforcement fund, drug forfeitures, and a military building fund.....all at least related to the task, and none of them “new” fund requests/sources.....they were all already funded.

Did Obama have a pot of money sitting there labeled “in case Obama wants to cap student loan repayments”....of course not, he pulled it over from somewhere else, exactly the same.

Your curiosity about EO vs emergency is reasonable.....I suspect it’s more because the Emergency declaration isn’t subject to congressional veto, as I understand it, and the EO is.

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From what I understand...


Feb 16, 2019, 10:37 PM

He can only appropriate the military funds because it's a national emergency with an aim to support the armed forces. That seems to be why he declared a national emergency, it gives him that right.

Congress granted a certain amount to the project, and Trump is wanting additional funding (appropriated from other projects) which seems to only be allowed in this case if he declares it a "national emergency." And even then he'd have to show the funds served a military purpose, which, seems to not exist.

As for the emergency declaration, Congress can override the emergency declaration with a joint resolution, which the president has to sign or have his veto overridden (unlikely) but it is possible (just unlikely).

This is pretty uncharted waters for the country...

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ahh, ok, thanks for the joint resolution 411.***


Feb 16, 2019, 10:40 PM



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uncharted waters? we're under 31 nat emergencies


Feb 16, 2019, 10:45 PM [ in reply to From what I understand... ]

right now...trumps will make 32...doesnt sound like uncharted waters

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If she's a hollerer, she'll be a screamer.
If she's a screamer, she'll get you arrested.


it's the reason it was used, not the action itself***


Feb 16, 2019, 10:59 PM



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G*dd*mn, did you b*tch when Obumma declared emergencies?


Feb 16, 2019, 12:52 PM [ in reply to And the slope is leading downwards with Trump. ]

I doubt it, you hypocrite. I dont like the idea that a Pres can do it, but it is perfectly within his right and the law to do it.

And if you dont think we have a major problem on our southern border, then you need to get your head out of nancy's fat a$$

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If she's a hollerer, she'll be a screamer.
If she's a screamer, she'll get you arrested.


Re: G*dd*mn, did you b*tch when Obumma declared emergencies?


Feb 18, 2019, 2:43 PM

Actually, crime statistics prove that there is not a crisis on the southern border. McAllen had zero (that's no) murders in 2018. El Paso, regardless of TheRump's lies) is a much safer city when compared to Detroit, Chicago, Charlotte, D.C., and many others.
Just because TheRump says it doesn't make it true. Conversely, if he says it, there's about an 80% chance it's not true.
Taking FoxFakeNews stories and TheRump comments as truth makes people look ignorant.

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we'll all be dead by then from net neutrality***


Feb 16, 2019, 10:01 AM



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If she's a hollerer, she'll be a screamer.
If she's a screamer, she'll get you arrested.


Re: we'll all be dead by then from net neutrality***


Feb 16, 2019, 11:55 AM

Soccerkrzy ain’t going to like this post.

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Re: Thanks Pubs!


Feb 16, 2019, 11:38 AM

McConnell is leaving quite a legacy behind, History will remember him a traitor.

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Only one tiny difference....


Feb 17, 2019, 3:16 PM

Obamacare2 two will cost just a smidgen more than a wall. Just a couple hundred times more. Trump's not using any new money. Nothing Congress hasn't already passed to be spent, somewhere. Or maybe captured from a drug dealer. Whatever. I wish future President Booker all the best on finding $1 trillion.

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Every action by a President should be judged on


Feb 18, 2019, 7:36 AM

the merits of the action, not relative to what other Presidents have done, or may do.

All this arguing about past Presidents is just trying to win internet points for one's political football team.

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