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YOUR BALANCE
If you gotta sec, donate to Glenville-Cashiers Rescue Squad
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If you gotta sec, donate to Glenville-Cashiers Rescue Squad


Dec 11, 2018, 12:32 PM

A buddy and I planned a backpacking trip this weekend.

All last week we were checking the weather. We wanted a snowy hike, but not a blizzard.

The location we chose was Panthertown Valley. We went up Saturday with the plan to camp at the shelter in Panthertown near "The Great Wall" and hike out Sunday. We checked MULTIPLE times with the Pisgah Ranger Station as to the weather status. Rangers told us that the Cashiers/Lake Toxaway Area we were at was only expected to get "4 inches of snow at most". The Rangers advised us that trails would remain open as they did not anticipate any abnormal conditions. We were only going to backpack about 6 miles at most with our packs on, and my truck is easily capable of getting through 4 inches of snow, so we went for it.


Everything was fine on Saturday. Very light snowfall. We stayed in a big A Frame shelter, and when we went to bed at 10:30pm the snow fall had stopped with only 2-3 inches on the ground. We thought we were golden.

WRONG.

We woke up at 7am with 3 FEET of snow, almost 4 in some spots.

We tried packing out, to no avail. The trail disappeared quickly and we were forced to bushwhack our way out. The side trail our shelter was on followed a creek. We knew if we followed the creek east, we would eventually run into the main trail. This proved...difficult. Took about 3 hours to go ~1000 yards. We found a large trail (which was the main trail) but we didnt realize it as we couldn't find any markers. Around 12:30pm Sunday, we called it quits. Set up our tent, crawled in our sleeping bags, and used our cell phones to call for an emergency rescue as we could see more weather and icy precipitation rolling in again.

The GS Rescue Squad used satellite to pinpoint our location, and then rode in on snowmobiles as close as they could. They used chainsaws to cut their way through a few fallen trees to get to us. We were uninjured and in good spirits. They took us back to the entrance of Panthertown via snowmobiles, and we were able to get a friend with a truck to come pick us up after we warmed up at the rescue station. Luckily, we were back home in our beds safe and sound Sunday night.


The rescue squad guys told us that this was a freak incident and no one forecasted this much snow dumping on that area. Less than 5 miles to the West of our campsite, they only got 5 inches of snow. 5 miles was the difference between 5 INCHES, and 3 FEET. Absolutely crazy. The Lake Toxaway area got more snowfall in 4 hours than the total average snowfall Alaska received in 2017. It was totally unexpected and no one was prepared for 3+ feet of snow that night.

The Glenville-Cashiers Rescue squad is also 100% volunteer. They are a great group of guys. I have already donated (and will continue to do so), but if you live in that area or like to hike and camp in the mountains, you may need them or a similar service one day. If you guys are inclined, please check them out and send them a small donation for their hard work and service. They deserve it!

http://gcrescuesquad.org/donate/

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I've got a second


Dec 11, 2018, 12:42 PM

but I don't have any money I want to donate.

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I always prefer to donate my time, anyway***


Dec 11, 2018, 12:46 PM



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frands and I were talking about (JUST) a hike up that way


Dec 11, 2018, 12:59 PM

on Saturday, but called it off because of the weather....that's pretty nutz.

What kind of gear do you use to camp in that weather?? I've got a 20° synthetic bag that I don't really trust below 35° (though i've camped in +/-15° with it...it sucked, but I lived), and a bunch of gear that'd fall in the '3-season' category

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The best sleeping bag money can buy


Dec 11, 2018, 1:20 PM

Get a surplus military modular sleeping bag. I bought one surplus for like $200. You can sleep comfortably from 60F to -30F. It's also waterproof. There's an outer gortex shell, which I use in the summer just as a cover. Then you have a normal 30-40 degree sleeping bag shell and then finally you have the thick down inner shell that can take you to -20F. With thermal underwear, etc. you can push that to -30F. Slept in mine from 60 down to single digits with no problems at all. Not sure I'd trust the gortex, but in theory you can stay dry in it in snow or rain. Always used mine in a tent.

Like this:

https://www.amazon.com/Military-Outdoor-Clothing-Previously-Sleeping/dp/B00GCHKW12/ref=sr_1_cc_3?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1544552118&sr=1-3-catcorr&keywords=sleeping+bag+surplus+modular

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How many folks have a sleeping bag?


Dec 11, 2018, 1:25 PM

I just realized I haven't owned one since I was about 16 or 17. I don't recall needing one.

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Well seeing as how you hate kids you probably disposed


Dec 11, 2018, 1:30 PM

of all of you childhood possessions

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3 times a year oldest son and I camp with scouts


Dec 11, 2018, 1:38 PM

Then camp another 3 times in the backyard. Give him another 3-4 years and I fully expect to go to NC camping some.

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Well..yeah; that goes w/o saying.


Dec 11, 2018, 2:05 PM [ in reply to Well seeing as how you hate kids you probably disposed ]

But I just wonder how many other folks have one. I never really thought about it, but I haven't had a need for one.

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Re: The best sleeping bag money can buy


Dec 11, 2018, 2:04 PM [ in reply to The best sleeping bag money can buy ]

No offense, but that's a terrible choice for a backpacking sleeping bag. Car camping, sure, but heck no for backpacking.

Its HUGE and more importantly, its heavy. That thing weighs almost 10 lbs.

My Kelty 0 degree bag weighs less than 4 lbs. I also use a fleece sleeping bag liner that weighs 9 ounces and with the sleeping bag, liner, and 4 R value sleeping pad, my sleeping set up can go down to -30 easily, and it still weighs a little under half of what that military bag weighs.


Keep in mind, I usually do ~30 miles on a 1 night trip. We only went ~4 miles in this time due to the conditions, and the fact that my friend has never backpacked before. In the warm weather, I try to keep weight under 20lbs. In winter, I try to keep weight under 40 lbs.

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Hey Tiggity, don't sweat it. I wouldn't take backpacking


Dec 11, 2018, 2:09 PM

advice from someone who just got stranded in a blizzard and had to be rescued via snowmobile by the Glenville-Cashiers Rescue Squad.

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Re: Hey Tiggity, don't sweat it. I wouldn't take backpacking


Dec 11, 2018, 2:29 PM

You're a pr1ck.

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*Your***


Dec 11, 2018, 2:32 PM



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A warm prick, though.***


Dec 11, 2018, 2:35 PM [ in reply to Re: Hey Tiggity, don't sweat it. I wouldn't take backpacking ]



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And he's not even our BEST one.***


Dec 11, 2018, 2:39 PM [ in reply to Re: Hey Tiggity, don't sweat it. I wouldn't take backpacking ]



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I need to update the Lunge prick


Dec 12, 2018, 3:46 PM

rankings

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I'm here


Dec 12, 2018, 3:50 PM

what are your other two wishes?

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#### you.


Dec 12, 2018, 3:56 PM [ in reply to I need to update the Lunge prick ]

Fingers crossed that gets me somewhere in the rankings!

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It's not for backpacking.


Dec 11, 2018, 2:29 PM [ in reply to Hey Tiggity, don't sweat it. I wouldn't take backpacking ]

Just said it works.

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Re: It's not for backpacking.


Dec 11, 2018, 2:42 PM

Touche, you did not say backpacking. It looks like a good set up though. I may have to grab one for winter overlanding. I do quite a bit of offroading/overlanding as well and there are hundreds of miles of 4x4 trails through Western North Carolina that I'm trying to creates maps of for gravelmap.com. I may grab one of these for my overlanding rig.

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I'm going to have to beg to retort.


Dec 11, 2018, 4:18 PM [ in reply to Re: The best sleeping bag money can buy ]

It worked well on our packs back in the day heading out into the field. If you can't carry it with 4 days of chow, two full canteens of water, rifle and rounds, and a carton of cigarettes, perhaps you should reevaluate those traits that make you think you're a man.

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Re: I'm going to have to beg to retort.


Dec 12, 2018, 9:19 AM

There is a difference between "being a man" and "being stupid".


There are many more efficient options for backpacking than a 10 lb sleeping bag the size of a laundry basket when fully compacted.

The idea of "real men dont mind if they carry heavy packs", is very, very stupid. It will get you in serious trouble out in the backcountry. Not only does it burn up your energy, but it can cause serious damage to your spine, hips, and knees. If you need to evacuate and cannot contact a rescue service, you have to rely on yourself. At that point, hauling a 70 lb pack is a major liability at that amount of weight is putting your life at serious risk. You will have to leave gear behind, and if its freezing and snowing outside and you have to leave crucial gear behind in order to lighten your load to evacuate, you will be in serious trouble.

There is no reason, in this day and age, to carry more than 35 lbs if you are only carrying your own gear. If you have little kids or a dog, you may have to carry some of their crap.


My sleeping bag weighs 3.5 lbs and my average pack size usually doesnt exceed 25 lbs for a 3 night trip. I can do ~60-70 miles on that set up alone and unassisted. I can also travel faster, use less energy, and keep my body in a better and healthier condition than someone being dumb and carrying a 70+ lb pack to "prove their a man". Real men dont do stupid #### to prove they are tough, real men make smart and efficient decisions that ensure their safety and well being as well as the well being of those around them. Now, I understand the military is different and their needs are different, but the military is also constantly seeking ways to lighten and streamline infantry gear. Any infantryman today, especially special forces operators, will tell you that lighter is always better and makes you more efficient. My pack was heavier this trip due to carrying extra socks, a heavier tent, an extra day and a half of food, and some extra blankets for my dog as my pup has never hiked in the snow and I wanted to ensure his comfort.

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He was talking about his time as a Marine


Dec 12, 2018, 1:53 PM

when he didn't have the luxury of carrying anything less than the kit he was sent out with.

But nice lecture, Captain Patriotism

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Whatever you've done, tokillagamecock has done it better***


Dec 12, 2018, 1:54 PM



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There is a difference between "being a man" and being stupid


Dec 12, 2018, 4:04 PM [ in reply to Re: I'm going to have to beg to retort. ]

Somewhere along the way of having to be extracted from several feet of snow knows that difference.

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Re: frands and I were talking about (JUST) a hike up that way


Dec 11, 2018, 1:59 PM [ in reply to frands and I were talking about (JUST) a hike up that way ]

I use a 0 degree Kelty bag. I actually use relatively cheap tents since I find the expensive ones arent much better in this climate. Most of the time I use a Hennessey Hammock unless I am winter camping and want warmth.

This was my gear Loadout:

Osprey Aether AG 60 pack
Kelty 0 degree bag
Ozark Trail 2-person 4 season tent with tarp bottom
Klymit inflatable pad with an R value of 4
Fleece sleeping bag liner
2x nalgene bottles
A flask of Blantons bourbon
Mini stove
12 oz cup
16 oz bowl
Sea Line 20L dry bag (for food)
Esse 6 survival knife for wood work/fire
Fire starter
Katadyn Pro water filter
Map and Compass with a Whistle
Battery Pack
First Aid kit
200 feet of parachord
Glock 19


Clothes were:
Carhart polyester beanie
Synthetic thermal base layer shirt and long johns
Patagonia fleece lined synthetic pants
6 pair of wool socks
Thurgood winter hiking boots
Marmot 0 degree backpacking jacket w. outer storm shell and inner down liner jacket
Swiss Gear gloves.

For food I stuck with Mountain House backpacking food, trail mix, granola bars, peta bread, peanut butter cups, hot chocolate packs, and coffee packs.


It was a heavy pack trip due to the snow.


We were prepared for 2-4 inches of snow, we were not prepared for 3 feet of snow. If we knew it was 3 feet, we would've either cancelled or just made a day trip. I dont have snowshoes or snow gaiters (I live in SC, why would I :P)


During warm weather camping, I take a 35L pack with maybe half of that stuff.

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Ok, so you had a gun (ammo I assume)


Dec 11, 2018, 2:40 PM

a knife, ample warmth, a shelter and a tent, and a way to make fire, not to mention a stove?

Heck, I would have just stayed put a few days. Go kill some squirrels, deer, bear, raccoons, whatever if needed. Skin them and cook them over your stove. Wait for sunshine then hike out. Second thought, a rifle would have been better. Still, why risk trudging through 3-foot snow to leave when you can't even see the trail anyway?

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Re: Ok, so you had a gun (ammo I assume)


Dec 11, 2018, 4:05 PM

The shelter we camped at was in a clearing along the "Great Wall Trail" on the west side of Panthertown vallery. We though that the snow accumulated heavier in out clearing than the rest of the trail. For the most part, it was true. But not by much. When we were hiking in the trees, the snow varied from 1 foot to 2.5 feet deep. One area we hit exceeded 3 feet though.


The trails are actually extremely well marked. However, one trail we were on, Granny Burrell Falls trail, was the issue. It was fine hiking in, but became so overgrown that when it snowed, we got lost and had to bushwhack.

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I'm going to assume that peta bread is NOT made from puppies


Dec 11, 2018, 2:46 PM [ in reply to Re: frands and I were talking about (JUST) a hike up that way ]

or kittens.

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Re: I'm going to assume that peta bread is NOT made from puppies


Dec 12, 2018, 9:49 AM

It is not. But you can stuff peta bread WITH puppies and kittens.

Highly recommended with some Cholula Hot Sauce.

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what kelty bag is it? I've thought that If i DO upgrade, I


Dec 11, 2018, 2:48 PM [ in reply to Re: frands and I were talking about (JUST) a hike up that way ]

might go with a Kelty, because price mostly...I've seen some good deals on Klymit 0° bags (costco, FTW) that are enticing, too.

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If you DO upgrade, I suggest this:


Dec 11, 2018, 2:52 PM

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Disney-Frozen-Elsa-and-Anna-Indoor-Outdoor-Kids-Sleeping-Bag-and-Backpack-Set/227898143?wpa_bd=&wpa_pg_seller_id=3787F12532C648F8BE5516B885179D3A&wpa_ref_id=60b04df19133929a56b2cec057a1fa24&wpa_aux_info=&wpa_tag=&wpa_pos=3&wpa_plmt=1145x1145_T-C-IG_TI_1-2_HL-INGRID-GRID-NY&wpa_aduid=06bc59a6-dd74-438c-9bab-c4b293d3a56b&wpa_pg_id=4125_546956_4128_133173&wpa_st=SleepingBags&wpa_tax=4125_546956_4128_133173&wpa_bucket=

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Dude, Let it go


Dec 11, 2018, 2:55 PM

Let it go
Don't hold it back anymore

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I actually think I've already got one of those in the house


Dec 11, 2018, 2:55 PM [ in reply to If you DO upgrade, I suggest this: ]

...plus a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles one

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We're talking about real camping


Dec 11, 2018, 4:32 PM [ in reply to If you DO upgrade, I suggest this: ]

not a sleep over at Steve's

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Re: what kelty bag is it? I've thought that If i DO upgrade, I


Dec 11, 2018, 3:57 PM [ in reply to what kelty bag is it? I've thought that If i DO upgrade, I ]

Klymit is good stuff. Not top shelf, but for they are the best in their price range. I love their sleeping pads. I sold my $300 SeaToSummit sleeping pad when I discovered the Klymit pad matched their performance at 1/4th the price.

The Kelty bag I have is the Cosmic 0 degree.

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I noticed you didn't list a camera


Dec 11, 2018, 4:37 PM [ in reply to Re: frands and I were talking about (JUST) a hike up that way ]

Just shooting with your cell?

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Re: I noticed you didn't list a camera


Dec 12, 2018, 8:59 AM

Yeah, just cell phone. I have a Samsung Galaxy which has the option of "Power Saving Mode" and "Maximum Power Saving mode". You can put it in Maximum Power Saving mode and get 30+ hours of battery life. I use an insulated cell phone case to keep the battery protected from the cold.

We also had a cell phone battery charger which can fully recharge your phone 4 times and can recharge itself with a solar cell, and my friend brought his cell phone signal booster.

We never lost service despite being inside a deep valley with 200+ foot tall granite cliffs.

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I was just curious about the camera part***


Dec 12, 2018, 9:09 AM



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BTW, this guy called it


Dec 11, 2018, 1:04 PM

https://booneweather.com/Forecast/Blowing+Rock

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Re: BTW, this guy called it


Dec 11, 2018, 2:06 PM

Whats interesting, is I was actually using that exact same weather forecast website. I also called the Pisgah Ranger station on Saturday morning to confirm the weather situation. Both that website and the Rangers said 4 inches, max.


BTW, we were no where near Boone. We were down near Cashiers, NC, only a few miles from the NC/SC border.

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Ok, well this settles it. Mistake #1 is trusting a


Dec 11, 2018, 2:47 PM

weatherman in the South about a snowfall forecast.

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Re: Ok, well this settles it. Mistake #1 is trusting a


Dec 11, 2018, 3:59 PM

No kidding. Pisgah Rangers were off their game as well.

We took extra battery packs for our phones, and my buddy brought a signal extender device which ensured we had signal the entire time. We were never in a position where our lives were in danger. Really uncomfortable? Yes. Life threatening? No. We were prepared enough to make sure our lives were never in danger. Was it impossible for us to return? Yes, but we had the planning and foresight to know what to do in case of emergency.

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They've shut down entire cities without a flake falling


Dec 11, 2018, 4:19 PM

I just have lived here long enough to believe it when I see it. 2" can mean a foot or two. Nothing can mean 8". A dusting can easily be 6". Not sure the weathermen in Columbia, SC have EVER nailed a winter weather forecast. Like ever. You're safest to assume it will be nothing, or a paralyzing snowfall. If they say 2" or so, it's totally up in the air.

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Re: They've shut down entire cities without a flake falling


Dec 11, 2018, 4:22 PM

You aint lying.


We figured, why not go for it.

We can either live like couch potatoes, or stick our necks out and make an adventure out of this very short life.

Yeah, we couldve been in a really bad situation, but we prepared as best we could and made sure we had a way to be rescued. In the end, we were fine, we walked away with experience, and a great story to tell people.

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curious...are you getting any sort of bill for this?***


Dec 11, 2018, 4:27 PM



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go fund him***


Dec 11, 2018, 4:28 PM



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no no...I didn't ask if "I" was getting a bill for this...


Dec 11, 2018, 4:31 PM

the answer to that question is



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Re: curious...are you getting any sort of bill for this?***


Dec 12, 2018, 8:41 AM [ in reply to curious...are you getting any sort of bill for this?*** ]

I did not receive any bill for this. Its a 100% volunteer service. I did, however, donate a few hundred dollars to their organization yesterday.

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few hundie puts them in the red for your


Dec 12, 2018, 3:58 PM

Extraction. C’mon mane at least square them dudes up.

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When that guy says its going to be the biggest storm


Dec 11, 2018, 4:34 PM [ in reply to Re: BTW, this guy called it ]

since '96 you prep for the worst

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had 18 inches of snow while i was


Dec 11, 2018, 4:26 PM

not hiking and just stayed indoors
at my home
and it was glorious

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SO HAPPY YOU'RE OK!***


Dec 11, 2018, 4:26 PM



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I survived nearly a quarter of an inch of unflavored


Dec 11, 2018, 4:31 PM [ in reply to had 18 inches of snow while i was ]

Hawaiian Shaved Ice. I managed to stay put and wait it out without calling for any rescue or fruity flavorings. That said, I WILL accept donations regardless.

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Who are you, and what in this world makes you think...


Dec 11, 2018, 7:22 PM

you can walk into the jounge asking for money and not even a hint of pigs showcasing your girlfriend’s bewbs? What do you think this is?

Fella, there are rules around here. Obviously my colleagues let it slide this afternoon, but I for one will not stand for such a blatant disregard for the rules. Pigs of bewbs or leave.

On a side note, everyone and his mother knew there was going to be lots of snow on Saturday and Sunday. EVERYONE. We had nearly 10 inches here in the top of Greenville county. I’d imagine Cashiers was expecting 20+. Are you actually playing with a full deck? We know exactly what kind of camping trip you were planning.

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that's a nice area, but I've never been there


Dec 11, 2018, 7:36 PM

when the forecast was for heavy snow.

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did this snow bring back memories of a trip up 81


Dec 11, 2018, 7:45 PM

hauling a trailer

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yes, yes it did! Ever since Kevin @ Roanoke Times compared


Dec 11, 2018, 7:54 PM

it to that Dec 2009 storm. I hear people were stuck on 81 near Bristol this time, that well could have been us on Christiansburg Mtn in 2009. By the Grace of God we got off on the 460 exit before traffic stopped. I never travel in the winter without a can of windshield de-icer anymore.

Truly, I still believe we came close to death on that trip home

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Bruh. You went CAMPIN in that ####?


Dec 11, 2018, 8:08 PM

Cotdamn that sounds dumb.

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Re: Bruh. You went CAMPIN in that ####?


Dec 12, 2018, 8:51 AM

I enjoy hiking and exploring remote places. I've done similar trips in places like Glacier and Banff Park in Canada, but in those cases I had sub zero gear and snowshoes.


I wouldn't say what we did was stupid. We watched the weather forecasts carefully and checked them dozens of times a day from Wednesday - Saturday. We called the Ranger station multiple times to get more accurate weather reports, and called the Rescue Squad in Cashiers for weather reports as well.

We had an extensive conversation with the Rangers at Pisgah Ranger Station. They are the ones that manage the Panthertown Valley area. The Rangers told us that we would be 100% safe to hike in Panthertown last weekend. They were the ones who told us we could expect "a maximum of 4 inches of snowfall". They told us that if they did not think it would be safe to hike, then they would have closed the entire valley as well as the roads leading to the valley. They said since their forecasts did not indicate significant danger, than they had no reason to close the trails. They were the ones who told us we would be safe to hike.

We took every precaution we could, and still got stuck. Even if we had gotten stuck out there for a 2nd night, we were not in a life threatening situation. Its possible we could have been, but we were not.


#### happens, you learn to deal with it. Out of hundreds of outdoor adventures, and thousands of miles logged in my boots across in 3 countries and every time zone of the U.S. (including Alaska and Hawaii), this is the only time I've ever required a rescue service. I made this post because I know there are people on this board that also like to hike and camp in this area, and they may need to use this Squad's services one day. So, I wanted to make sure people know these guys do great work and deserve our support if we can give it.

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well lemme tellya what I did


Dec 12, 2018, 9:10 AM

I sat on my couch and watched the weather on the local news. And cross referenced that with a weather app.

It was then quickly determined that 4 inches were coming to metro Greenville and well over a foot in the mountains.

Now, I was not planning on hiking/exporing/camping that weekend. But if I were......shooooweeeee, you can betchyer last peso I would have canceled that trip.

Lesson here? Sometimes you gotta realize you can’t see the forest for the trees!

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Re: well lemme tellya what I did


Dec 12, 2018, 10:14 AM

The bad information we received didnt help.

When I woke up Sunday and saw the 3 feet of snow around our shelter, the first thing I did was tap on my buddy's tent and said "Morning, you know we are a couple of idiots, right?". He was confused at first, then he looked outside.


What I have learned, is that you cant predict where the snow will accumulate. Just 5 miles west of us, they only got 3-4 inches with no snow on the roads. Our location, and everything to the East and to the North got 1-3 feet.

I will probably invest in some good snow shoes after this. Its not going to stop my adventurous spirit, but its given me good insight.

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Re: Bruh. You went CAMPIN in that ####?


Dec 9, 2016, 8:04 PM [ in reply to Re: Bruh. You went CAMPIN in that ####? ]



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