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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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I think the socialist will eventually break...
Sep 11, 2018, 9:39 PM
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from the democratic party.
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Legend [15730]
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What about the conservatives? Will they stick with the Pubs?***
Sep 11, 2018, 10:12 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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That's an interesting question.
Sep 11, 2018, 10:18 PM
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Conservative are the Pub base. I think we need to cull through the RNC and week out the RINOs but I don't think we will entrust anyone with our party.
Wouldn't it be interesting if the RINOs defected to the dem party where they belong. I didn't vote in the McCain/Obama election because imo, they were both progressives.
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Oculus Spirit [82987]
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What makes Trump more conservative than McCain?***
Sep 11, 2018, 10:30 PM
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All-In [31847]
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Re: How was McCain a progressive?***
Sep 12, 2018, 12:06 PM
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His most recent incident was Obamacare vote.
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Rock Defender [53]
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LOL***
Sep 12, 2018, 12:20 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Your awe inspiring commentary never ceases to astound me.***
Sep 12, 2018, 12:23 PM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Obamacare isn't really liberal legislation. That better?***
Sep 12, 2018, 12:26 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Excellent.
Sep 12, 2018, 12:42 PM
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It certainly is. Now we can agree to disagree, that's how gentlemen settle an immutable difference of opinion. I appreciate that the times in which we grew up differ and attribute that to our variance of opinions. I see this as a redefining of socialism which justifies socialism small portions at a time.
You see it as fair and I ask why?
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Rock Defender [53]
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Socialism has been justified in the US for generations.
Sep 12, 2018, 12:48 PM
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Armed forces, police, utilities(at times), fire, schools, roads, air traffic.
Healthcare has been left out of that except for the VA and Tricare, medicaid and medicare. Obamacare doesn't supply a government option and simply requires private health insurance. Medicaid expansion you could argue is a liberal position, but the ACA has pretty conservative principals at its heart. The Heritage Foundation thought so.
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Re: Socialism has been justified in the US for generations.
Sep 12, 2018, 1:02 PM
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You're right in that subject line.
Government fine for not buying something? I'd say you're more right about that not being socialistic than anything else you said. That puts me to thinking it was communism more than socialism.
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All-In [48798]
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Insurance is both the cause and effect of the price of
Sep 12, 2018, 3:11 PM
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healthcare. But the price if healthcare funds all the healthcare innovations we currently enjoy. Although, I now have a friend who runs a start up pharma company in the late stages of raising venture capital. He was a bigwig with a couple of existing pharma powerhouses before that, and he flat out admits that those companies are not actively looking to cure any diseases.
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Legend [15730]
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Rock Defender [53]
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It's chock full of a whole lot of compromises, so
Sep 13, 2018, 3:31 PM
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centrist?
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Legend [15730]
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Well, California is “Eastern America” is you live in Hawaii.
Sep 13, 2018, 4:10 PM
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I guess if you live in the left side of the American Political Spectrum, then a federal government demand that everyone buy healthcare sounds centrist.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Well that's to enable everyone to purchase insurance
Sep 13, 2018, 4:13 PM
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regardless of pre-existing condition. Without it, you'd need a government takeover.
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Legend [15730]
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Even then, couldn’t doctors take money from rich people to
Sep 13, 2018, 4:30 PM
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perform services? I really don’t know how we make this fair unless we place all healthcare under the employment of the federal government and punish any outside services
We’ll get there. Progress...always progress...
Now, about that first aid merit badge...
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Oculus Spirit [82987]
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Thinking it was because McCain didn’t “act” like a tough
Sep 12, 2018, 1:01 PM
[ in reply to Re: How was McCain a progressive?*** ] |
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guy and tweet tough guy slogans at people who disagreed with him.
He was more conservative in the regard that he wanted to cut spending. This ain’t in Trump’s wheelhouse.
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Why bring up tweets.
Sep 12, 2018, 1:10 PM
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That's a social type comment and misdirects the conversation.
Trump wants to reduce spending in a permanent fashion. He's cutting back on bureaucrats' jobs and reducing bureaucratic authority. Frankly, I don't agree with either of them on military spending. I think our weapons R&D spending should remain high but we shouldn't continue to protect the world. That is a secular humanistic goal, imo.
Or efforts to dominate the world should be spent on economics in ways such as Trump is now doing. Imo, to care for our people we should put our interest first. We should end foreign aid until our debt is paid in full.
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Oculus Spirit [82987]
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Because the tweets fool many in his base into
Sep 12, 2018, 1:44 PM
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thinking he’s conservative. Which he ain’t. Not a fiscal conservative anyway. I bet he hasn’t once talked about capping Medicaid, Medicare, or raising the SS age. This will have to happen in the future along with capping defense.
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All-In [43992]
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All-In [48798]
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15 whole billion?
Sep 13, 2018, 4:31 PM
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is that included in the 3.2 trillion deficit increase projected now?
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All-In [31847]
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He voted against the GOP plan because he didn't....
Sep 12, 2018, 3:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: How was McCain a progressive?*** ] |
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think it was a good plan. That is not the same as a vote for the ACA...especially considering he DIDN'T VOTE FOR THE ACA.
The attempted repeal of the ACA was a dog's breakfast and horribly mis-managed, in large part by the WH.
So in your mind, not voting or supporting ACA originally and not voting for the flawed GOP repeal efforts makes him a progressive?
That can't be what you're saying.
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Legend [15730]
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I’m just glad the subject didn’t relate to some guy you had tied up in your basement.***
Sep 13, 2018, 2:09 PM
[ in reply to That's an interesting question. ] |
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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I do not understand...
Sep 13, 2018, 2:54 PM
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how you know I have a guy tied up in my basement.
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Legend [15492]
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Re: I do not understand...
Sep 13, 2018, 3:20 PM
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Nice try 88, erryone knows it's a chick tied up in your basement.
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Finally someone here believes I'm hetro.***
Sep 13, 2018, 8:11 PM
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Legend [15730]
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Darn it. I am sick of my words being twisted on this site.
Sep 13, 2018, 3:25 PM
[ in reply to I do not understand... ] |
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I never said you didn’t have someone tied up in your basement. That would be presumptuous on my part. I said that I was glad this subject didn’t pertain to that. Obviously because that would mean Good Samaritan laws would require us to get involved and, really, who has the time?
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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So I should release him immediately?***
Sep 13, 2018, 4:09 PM
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Legend [15730]
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Has he broken?***
Sep 13, 2018, 4:11 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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You wouldn't believe the things he's confessed to doing.
Sep 13, 2018, 8:09 PM
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I didn't believe him and I was involved in most of them.
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Heisman Winner [111342]
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Re: I think the socialist will eventually break...
Sep 11, 2018, 10:47 PM
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and the evangelical republicans will eventually turn their backs on trump. Haha, J/k, that will never happen.
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All-In [34100]
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That would be a mistake.***
Sep 11, 2018, 11:02 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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For the dems is would be horrible.
Sep 12, 2018, 9:31 AM
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I can see it happening with the momentum socialism has. The youth and energy of the socialist movement has the potential to overwhelm the party if the more reasonable dems continue to refuse to reject the movement and educate youth to the reality of a socalist movement.
I believe the dems are trying to water down the socialist's message. I do not believe the movement is defined as dems are presenting it.
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All-In [34100]
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I'm seeing the same thing.***
Sep 12, 2018, 8:53 PM
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Heisman Winner [111342]
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we saw it in the last election when Bernie Supporters
Sep 12, 2018, 9:22 PM
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did not show up to vote Hillary. Now look where we are.
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All-In [34100]
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Correct.***
Sep 12, 2018, 9:40 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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I think your party will be straddle the fence in 2020.
Sep 12, 2018, 11:04 PM
[ in reply to we saw it in the last election when Bernie Supporters ] |
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It appears the primary will be a cat fight between the socialist and the moderate democrats. In order to fend off the socialist the mods will have to be honest about socialism. That will sorely offend the socialist and turn them away. The movement will continue but only in the classrooms and streets.
The moderate dems will then be left to romance socialism in order to attract the movement which will leave them extremely vulnerable to defections to the pub party. Trump couldn't ask for more.
You guys need to speak out now. If you remain silent you will silently watch Trump, then another populist or republican govern for the foreseeable future.
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110%er [9174]
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He who doesn't vote, does not have a party..
Sep 14, 2018, 6:58 AM
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-Doc
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110%er [5508]
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Re: I think the socialist will eventually break...
Sep 12, 2018, 9:51 AM
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That would be great. We need more options.
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Legend [15492]
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Re: I think the socialist will eventually break...
Sep 12, 2018, 11:59 AM
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I'm not aware of any Socialists in the Dem Party.
Socialism is when the state owns everything, land, means of production, everything.
Not aware of any Dems proposing that. Can you think of one?
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Thus, someone is watering down the socialist's message.
Sep 12, 2018, 12:18 PM
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Several candidates are saying healthcare for all, free education for all...and claiming they are socialist. Others, as yourself, are attempting to water down their message saying that they misuse the term. What you are attempting to do is redefine the connotations of socialism. Yet, I doubt the independents or most of the democratic party isn't concerned about the socialistic uprising in the party. If they weren't you wouldn't be trying to redefine the meaning.
That's fine and you have every right to believe that all those like Sanders, Pocahontas and that other political dingbat in NY don't know mean what they say when they claim to be socialist but you and I know that two of those three fully understand the definition of socialism.
We also know that their accurate descriptions of how socialism works is what is fueling the movement which has taking a strangle hold on the democratic party.
I think it's insulting to those three and the other self proclaimed socialist to say they misuse the term.
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Thus, someone is watering down the socialist's message.
Sep 12, 2018, 6:39 PM
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Several candidates are saying healthcare for all, free education for all...and claiming they are socialist. Others, as yourself, are attempting to water down their message saying that they misuse the term. What you are attempting to do is redefine the connotations of socialism. Yet, I doubt the independents or most of the democratic party isn't concerned about the socialistic uprising in the party. If they weren't you wouldn't be trying to redefine the meaning.
That's fine and you have every right to believe that all those like Sanders, Pocahontas and that other political dingbat in NY don't know mean what they say when they claim to be socialist but you and I know that two of those three fully understand the definition of socialism.
We also know that their accurate descriptions of how socialism works is what is fueling the movement which has taking a strangle hold on the democratic party.
I think it's insulting to those three and the other self proclaimed socialist to say they misuse the term.
I appreciate you concern and passion my friend, but passion doesn't change the truth. None of the European countries are socialist countries but have some aspects of socialist ideas. In America we also have some aspects of socialist ideas like Medicare and Social Security.
I find it odd that having Medicare and Medicare for all is some giant sloppy kiss and embrace of Marx and Engels.
Socialism is when the state owns everything. Anything short of that is not Socialism. That is just the facts. But when you throw around the word "Socialism", that isn't what you're actually describing.
Just because kittens are born in an oven, doesn't make them biscuits. 
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Oculus Spirit [93606]
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Okee dokee.
Sep 12, 2018, 11:07 PM
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Hide and watch what happens.
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Okee dokee.
Sep 13, 2018, 10:07 AM
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Russia is a Republic.
The United States is a Democratic Republic.
See the difference?
China is a Socialist Country
Sweden is a Democratic Socialist Country.
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110%er [9174]
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Butter, you are so naive...
Sep 14, 2018, 7:01 AM
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That pure definition hook is in your mouth. It would almost be fun to watch a good, yank...
-Doc
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All-In [31847]
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