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YOUR BALANCE
New NET ranking
Tiger Boards - Clemson Basketball
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Replies: 15
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New NET ranking

13

Mar 14, 2024, 8:04 AM
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We dropped 9 places due to that game How do you drop 9 places for a quad 2 loss this late in the season? By getting hammered by a team by a bigger margin than anyone else that season that wasn’t a quad 4 team. Brad himself claimed to have unlocked the mysteries of the NET and complain about how they were gamed by other schools. The announcers talked about it. Then he let BC abuse his team. We’re now 35 in NET. We’ve been left out at 35 RPI. We’ve been left out at 45 NET.

For all the talk that we are a lock, Big Game Brad has found a way to open the door for an Armageddon scenario. The presumption that Clemson was a lock was based on the tremendous gap between our NET ranking and the next best team in the conference. Even as we lost games in the first half of the conference schedule that gap persisted. A 26 NET (where we were yesterday) was safely in. But 35, with 3 days of basketball left to play, is not the same category.

We now have UVA at 52, Clemson at 35, Wake Forest at 36, and PItt at 45. If UVA blows out BC, Pitt/Wake play a close one, and Pitt wins out to grab an ACC title, Clemson will likely have the lowest NET ranking of the 5 at large ACC possibilities. The ACC may get 5. Most brackets project 4. It isn’t getting 6. It’s remote, but only Brad’s total failures as a coach have allowed the scenario to exist. Best Wake - done. Beat BC - done.

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Re: New NET ranking

6

Mar 14, 2024, 8:11 AM
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A couple weeks ago, when we still had 4 games left, someone on Tigernet posed the question "How will we finish these last 4 games" and I thought some of the answers were a bit harsh in their criticism of Brad. Now, I totally get it. Harsh......maybe. But they were spot on and the performance the past 2 weeks bears that out.

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Myself along with several others...

5

Mar 14, 2024, 8:18 AM
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made posts similar to the one you mentioned. When you've seen this movie multiple times over the last 14 years, it isn't hard to predict how it's likely going to end.

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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: New NET ranking

1

Mar 14, 2024, 8:28 AM [ in reply to Re: New NET ranking ]
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Here. I think I posted we would finish at 70 net so I was too harsh. Haha. Clemson basketball always craps the bed. Never fails.

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Whatever it takes

3

Mar 14, 2024, 8:20 AM
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At this point I’m ready to move on. Neff apparently needs a tragedy to occur. So be it.

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Re: New NET ranking


Mar 14, 2024, 8:27 AM
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So, what you're saying is that we need BC to beat UVA or things could get dicey.

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Boils down to risk tolerance

1

Mar 14, 2024, 8:35 AM
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One could see the administration as being very risk averse, which would explain their reluctance to move away from Brad all these years. At some point, though, you have to ask what is the downside? Brad just keeps on making it look smaller . . . and I'm talking about from a wins and losses, interest in the program perspective. From a dollars and cents perspective, I'm not sure there's much of a downside at all.

If you want to break through, if you want to get a big return, you have to be willing to take a risk.

Call us a football school. Fine! The fact that mbb isn't the primary driver of the athletic department's success means that Clemson should be more risk tolerant in basketball, not less.

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Re: New NET ranking


Mar 14, 2024, 8:44 AM
Reply

viztiz® said:

We dropped 9 places due to that game How do you drop 9 places for a quad 2 loss this late in the season? By getting hammered by a team by a bigger margin than anyone else that season that wasn’t a quad 4 team. Brad himself claimed to have unlocked the mysteries of the NET and complain about how they were gamed by other schools. The announcers talked about it. Then he let BC abuse his team. We’re now 35 in NET. We’ve been left out at 35 RPI. We’ve been left out at 45 NET.

For all the talk that we are a lock, Big Game Brad has found a way to open the door for an Armageddon scenario. The presumption that Clemson was a lock was based on the tremendous gap between our NET ranking and the next best team in the conference. Even as we lost games in the first half of the conference schedule that gap persisted. A 26 NET (where we were yesterday) was safely in. But 35, with 3 days of basketball left to play, is not the same category.

We now have UVA at 52, Clemson at 35, Wake Forest at 36, and PItt at 45. If UVA blows out BC, Pitt/Wake play a close one, and Pitt wins out to grab an ACC title, Clemson will likely have the lowest NET ranking of the 5 at large ACC possibilities. The ACC may get 5. Most brackets project 4. It isn’t getting 6. It’s remote, but only Brad’s total failures as a coach have allowed the scenario to exist. Best Wake - done. Beat BC - done.


Excellent points. I hope we get in and win 6 games but unless Brad gets in and makes the second weekend (which I think is a 10% chance), he needs to be dismissed. Not making the tournament might finally shut up the loyalists who sing his praises

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we have 5 quad 1 wins, 5 quad 2 wins, 1 quad 3 loss and 0 quad 4 losses


Mar 14, 2024, 9:15 AM
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we are in - not even on the bubble and if a wildcard ACC team wins the tourney then it's going to knock out an actual bubble team, not us - will have nothing to do with conference affiliation.

Brad and his SRs are totally to blame for that last night. BC may be hot at the moment and we played a watered down version of them earlier this year, but that doesn't matter. No heart to even keep it close at the end and that could ultimately land us in a tougher first round matchup and now assured of a tougher 2nd round matchup. I don't see this team winning more than a game if that in the NCAAT. If they don't win at least 1, he should be sent packing on the spot. He probably should be sent packing with just 2 but I doubt Neff would. You may see something where the contract is not extended and that forces him to just move on. He has 2 years left on the current. Buyout goes up after 4/30 so a decision will be soon after the tourney. Buyout would be about $2mil if triggered by 4/30. My guess is he manages to win one, keeps his job for yet another year and we are back having this same conversation.

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Re: we have 5 quad 1 wins, 5 quad 2 wins, 1 quad 3 loss and 0 quad 4 losses


Mar 14, 2024, 9:50 AM
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I said it was remote. But it’s not as simple as you’re trying to make it. Until yesterday the gap between 3rd and the rest of the ACC was large enough that it didn’t matter. Now there is the very good chance that 4-5 teams in the ACC will all be within 10 places of each other with Clemson at the bottom of the list. It was inconceivable a few weeks ago. Improbable yesterday. As an idiot that actually cares about basketball for 30+ years I’ve scrutinized this process. We aren’t going to hold onto a 5 or 6 seed if UVA and Wake both make the field with equal better NETs and an undefeated record against us. If Pitt wins they’ll have a better NET than us. They’re close now and they’re only in the receiving some votes territory - way outside what would be considered the bubble. You also have to look at who is just below us in the bracket projections and who is still alive. As on example, Miss St is a consensus 8 seed with a 41 NET. At 26 NET we should be a mid 7 seed. We already over seeded on most boards. At 35 we should be a 9 seed. There are a lot of teams beneath with plenty of room to knock us down.

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it's not just about the NET ranking, it's about the NET quad wins and losses

1

Mar 14, 2024, 10:03 AM
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I imagine our ranking will go up not down over the next few days as well. We have road wins at Bama and UNC, it's a non-starter for us being on the bubble. We also have won a number of other road games which the tourney committee favors. They aren't choosing an ACC team over another because of # of spots to a league. That's not how it works at all. Those other ACC teams that have similar conf records like Pitt, WF and UVA didn't play the schedules in non-conf that the NCAA selection committee demands.

We have probably fallen to a 7 seed but still may be then bottom of 6 seeds. Outside chance at one of the top 8s.

A month or so ago when the NCAA did their mock selection and seeded the top 16 teams, Clemson was one of the teams mentioned as one of the 3 that didn't make the top 16 but given heavy consideration. Out NET at that time was not close to top 16. Lunardi has a really good track record for not just picking who's in but also pretty spot on with seeding as he has all the historical analytics to go off of. It's not guessing that he is doing or some eyeball test. If he was, he might come up with a totally different seed or teams being in but that's not his job - he's not a pundit or talkshow host.

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Re: it's not just about the NET ranking, it's about the NET quad wins and losses


Mar 14, 2024, 12:52 PM
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You either not grasping my point or being argumentative. You are trying to speak in absolutes “they’re NOT …”, “that’s not how it works AT ALL”.

Again. I said it was remote. You’re acting like it’s impossible. Literally set in stone. You’re throwing quad records. Pitt is 8-8 in quad 1&2. With the chance improve to a better position than Clemson in both NET and quad 1&2 wins and you’re acting like our position is intractable. They’re not even considered on the bubble. Wake is 9-11 but 1-7 in q1 but considered significantly more likely to make it in. Virginia is 9-9. They all have a chance to improve their NET and their q1&2 wins. Once they all get close enough to one another they will inevitably be compared to each other. No, the committee isn’t going to look at ACC standings and say pick 4 or 5. All the multibid league, of which 7 are projected to have 3 or more, have several teams at the lower end of making it in that can still make dynamic moves. We moved 9 spots from a single game. Jerry Palm has us a 7 now and he has consistently been one of the most generous all season. That leaves about 15 at large spots between Clemson and the bubble. With 4 full days of basketball left and virtually everyone of those teams still playing quality matchups the chances are infinitely higher than zero that Clemson could slip out of this thing. I’m not betting on it. I don’t expect it. But I knew we weren’t making it last year and a considerable number of people think we were screwed and that it was inexplicable. Anybody that watches this knew we weren’t making it. And I’m just saying that are chance of missing this year is now non-zero.

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Re: New NET ranking


Mar 14, 2024, 9:16 AM
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And the icing on the cake is, this is Brad's "best team ever".

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Screw Calford.


Re: New NET ranking


Mar 14, 2024, 1:15 PM
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Lunardi and Palm don't make the selections. The committee might go FSU football on us. We look like Jordan Travis on crutches the last couple games.

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Re: New NET ranking

1

Mar 14, 2024, 11:55 AM
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I hate saying his name at this point

Our coach is known for this. It sucks, but this is what you get from him 9 times out of 10.


Message was edited by: ROYBus10®


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Re: New NET ranking


Mar 14, 2024, 11:59 AM
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This team had more talent than any I’ve seen in a long time. Brad has found a way to embarrass us yet again.

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Tiger Boards - Clemson Basketball
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